[washingtonismoney]

4.  Patterson was perhaps so-so, and depended on his tight ends, who were fine but certainly not yards-after-catch guys.
...
We've played well at South Bend in recent years.  Notre Dame has the better DL and Ol, Stanford the better TEs, WRs, QB, RB, and defensive backs.

I thought Patterson was more the victim of his teammates than himself a so-so player. To be honest I think his skillset is better than Costello's -- though KJ seems to have a certain moxie and knack for big plays that Patterson lacks. 

With respect to your breakdown, I'd say N.D. has the much better defensive line. I'm not totally sold by their offensive line but it's certainly more stable. DBs are about even. I agree with your characterization of the offensive skill players. Given injuries I'd give the edge to ND's LBs.

[washingtonismoney]

4.  Patterson was perhaps so-so, and depended on his tight ends, who were fine but certainly not yards-after-catch guys.
...
We've played well at South Bend in recent years.  Notre Dame has the better DL and Ol, Stanford the better TEs, WRs, QB, RB, and defensive backs.

I thought Patterson was more the victim of his teammates than himself a so-so player. To be honest I think his skillset is better than Costello's -- though KJ seems to have a certain moxie and knack for big plays that Patterson lacks. 

With respect to your breakdown, I'd say N.D. has the much better defensive line. I'm not totally sold by their offensive line but it's certainly more stable. DBs are about even. I agree with your characterization of the offensive skill players. Given injuries I'd give the edge to ND's LBs.

[BostonCard]

Is watching the oregon game a good sample of stanford?  Obviously it has been the most execting game, but is that the best representation of who you are as a team?

It's hard to tell given that we have only played four games.  The game against Oregon probably featured Costello and the passing game at its best (with the SDSU also a good game from him).  So that probably represents his ceiling, while the Davis game (especially the first half) would represent his floor.  The running game was probably representative of what we've seen this season through four games, though we are hoping we haven't seen the ceiling yet.

On defense, the first half of the Oregon game was our worst half of defensive football to date (we gave up more points in the first half against Oregon than in the first three games combined).  The second half of the Oregon was probably more representative (though the 80-yard scoop and score was not characteristic, we've gotten a bunch of turnovers deep in our own territory to stop opponents' promising drives).

Bottom line is that the game was probably offensively a bit better than we've seen elsewhere, and defensively a bit worse than what we've seen, but probably not decidedly uncharacteristic.

Glad you enjoyed the game.  We sure did.

BC

[BostonCard]

Is watching the oregon game a good sample of stanford?  Obviously it has been the most execting game, but is that the best representation of who you are as a team?

It's hard to tell given that we have only played four games.  The game against Oregon probably featured Costello and the passing game at its best (with the SDSU also a good game from him).  So that probably represents his ceiling, while the Davis game (especially the first half) would represent his floor.  The running game was probably representative of what we've seen this season through four games, though we are hoping we haven't seen the ceiling yet.

On defense, the first half of the Oregon game was our worst half of defensive football to date (we gave up more points in the first half against Oregon than in the first three games combined).  The second half of the Oregon was probably more representative (though the 80-yard scoop and score was not characteristic, we've gotten a bunch of turnovers deep in our own territory to stop opponents' promising drives).

Bottom line is that the game was probably offensively a bit better than we've seen elsewhere, and defensively a bit worse than what we've seen, but probably not decidedly uncharacteristic.

Glad you enjoyed the game.  We sure did.

BC

[NDIrish]

We were suppose to have this great secondary, and they are really hard hitters and solid tacklers, but they are just a step too late.

Not sure if "a step too late" will be a specific issue against Stanford or not.

However, it appears the und starting nickel backfield runs 5'11'', 5'11'', 6'0'', 6'0'', 6'1''.
So, how well will they cover our guys catching passes who go 6'2'', 6'2'', 6'3'' (that's JJAW - seems taller to me), 6'5'', 6'7''.
Outreaching the defenders is really the plus feature of the Stanford offense right now.

ND has a lot of depth on the D-Line, which can really help us in the 4th quarter, and they area really good at getting pressure, but not sacks - just a step behind.  Our MLB are beasts, but once again - a step behind (kind of a theme huh). 

The mystery component of the Stanford offense is what has happened to the run game.
The optimistic (from Stanford's POV) take is that the problems are largely a combination of OL health and having faced the #2 and #4 rush defenses in the country (ypg) so far this year. Well, those two and #89 $C and not ranked because they are FCS Davis. und comes in at #62, allowing 145 yds/gm and 3.45 yds/carry.

[Davis, by the way, is allowing a very respectable 3.5 yds/carry and 115 yds/game on rush defense. Though of course outside of Stanford that is against San Jose State, San Diego, and Idaho.]

Healthy or not, Stanford looks to have most of their nominal starting OL in the game at South Bend. Love seems to be healthy and Trevor Speights comes back. If we can get anything out of the run game, even if it is only to keep the und safeties up, then that is a bonus.

One thing that may help ND is that their own receivers are that tall or taller, so they are at least use to battling with guys of the height, doesnt mean they are gonna win them, lol, but they have at least seen it.

[NDIrish]

We were suppose to have this great secondary, and they are really hard hitters and solid tacklers, but they are just a step too late.

Not sure if "a step too late" will be a specific issue against Stanford or not.

However, it appears the und starting nickel backfield runs 5'11'', 5'11'', 6'0'', 6'0'', 6'1''.
So, how well will they cover our guys catching passes who go 6'2'', 6'2'', 6'3'' (that's JJAW - seems taller to me), 6'5'', 6'7''.
Outreaching the defenders is really the plus feature of the Stanford offense right now.

ND has a lot of depth on the D-Line, which can really help us in the 4th quarter, and they area really good at getting pressure, but not sacks - just a step behind.  Our MLB are beasts, but once again - a step behind (kind of a theme huh). 

The mystery component of the Stanford offense is what has happened to the run game.
The optimistic (from Stanford's POV) take is that the problems are largely a combination of OL health and having faced the #2 and #4 rush defenses in the country (ypg) so far this year. Well, those two and #89 $C and not ranked because they are FCS Davis. und comes in at #62, allowing 145 yds/gm and 3.45 yds/carry.

[Davis, by the way, is allowing a very respectable 3.5 yds/carry and 115 yds/game on rush defense. Though of course outside of Stanford that is against San Jose State, San Diego, and Idaho.]

Healthy or not, Stanford looks to have most of their nominal starting OL in the game at South Bend. Love seems to be healthy and Trevor Speights comes back. If we can get anything out of the run game, even if it is only to keep the und safeties up, then that is a bonus.

One thing that may help ND is that their own receivers are that tall or taller, so they are at least use to battling with guys of the height, doesnt mean they are gonna win them, lol, but they have at least seen it.

[Snorlax94]

I just finished watching (most) of the wake forest game and I have to say, Notre Dame really puzzles me.

First, the scariest part of their offense, to me, is the yac, the downfield blocking, the big receivers, and the downhill running. Those strengths are synergistic and scary — even if you limit the receivers at first, they are big, and they keep delivering blows, and soon, you don’t wanna tackle them anymore. Add that to a running game that hammers you and some textbook downfield blocking and stopping their offense late in the game with a tenderized defense feels daunting. I see ND pulling away from a lot of opponents late in games the way alabama did with Scarborough against washington in 2016. No wonder Kelly is so eager to have a better pocket passer. It’s the complementary missing piece to a scary offense. If Stanford traditionally runs a smashmouth offense, this is a smashpass offense.

The weird part is their defense. I didn’t watch the Michigan game yet, but apparently they limited Michigan to one offensive touchdown. And then, even though wake forest didn’t score a lot, they made it into the red zone on five of their first six trips, and the first four in the first half. They missed two field goals, but they were in the red zone. If Stanford gets opportunities like those, I think they do a much better job capitalizing. And then the run defense. Against wake forest, they seem to be too late for a fast running back, and they seemed vulnerable to slow-developing run plays, with a patient running back. Sound familiar?

But then, how did they limit Michigan to just one touchdown??? Which defense does Stanford play this weekend?

[Snorlax94]

I just finished watching (most) of the wake forest game and I have to say, Notre Dame really puzzles me.

First, the scariest part of their offense, to me, is the yac, the downfield blocking, the big receivers, and the downhill running. Those strengths are synergistic and scary — even if you limit the receivers at first, they are big, and they keep delivering blows, and soon, you don’t wanna tackle them anymore. Add that to a running game that hammers you and some textbook downfield blocking and stopping their offense late in the game with a tenderized defense feels daunting. I see ND pulling away from a lot of opponents late in games the way alabama did with Scarborough against washington in 2016. No wonder Kelly is so eager to have a better pocket passer. It’s the complementary missing piece to a scary offense. If Stanford traditionally runs a smashmouth offense, this is a smashpass offense.

The weird part is their defense. I didn’t watch the Michigan game yet, but apparently they limited Michigan to one offensive touchdown. And then, even though wake forest didn’t score a lot, they made it into the red zone on five of their first six trips, and the first four in the first half. They missed two field goals, but they were in the red zone. If Stanford gets opportunities like those, I think they do a much better job capitalizing. And then the run defense. Against wake forest, they seem to be too late for a fast running back, and they seemed vulnerable to slow-developing run plays, with a patient running back. Sound familiar?

But then, how did they limit Michigan to just one touchdown??? Which defense does Stanford play this weekend?

[NDIrish]

I just finished watching (most) of the wake forest game and I have to say, Notre Dame really puzzles me.

First, the scariest part of their offense, to me, is the yac, the downfield blocking, the big receivers, and the downhill running. Those strengths are synergistic and scary — even if you limit the receivers at first, they are big, and they keep delivering blows, and soon, you don’t wanna tackle them anymore. Add that to a running game that hammers you and some textbook downfield blocking and stopping their offense late in the game with a tenderized defense feels daunting. I see ND pulling away from a lot of opponents late in games the way alabama did with Scarborough against washington in 2016.  No wonder Kelly is so eager to have a better pocket passer. It’s the complementary missing piece to a scary offense. If Stanford traditionally runs a smashmouth offense, this is a smashpass offense.

The weird part is their defense. I didn’t watch the Michigan game yet, but apparently they limited Michigan to one offensive touchdown. And then, even though wake forest didn’t score a lot, they made it into the red zone on five of their first six trips, and the first four in the first half. They missed two field goals, but they were in the red zone. If Stanford gets opportunities like those,  I think they do a much better job capitalizing. And then the run defense. Against wake forest, they seem to be too late for a fast running back, and they seemed vulnerable to slow-developing run plays, with a patient running back. Sound familiar?

But then, how did they limit Michigan to just one touchdown??? Which defense does Stanford play this weekend?

You are not the only one that they puzzle... haha.  With the offense, that has always been the hope of what this offense can do, but these receivers... are wildly inconsistent.  There is really some great talent there, they need to just start showing it every week.  They were their against michigan and wake forest, not so much the other games.

for the defense..  that has been what i have been seeing all year.  This supposedly "championship level" defense has gotten beat a lot.  Now, against, WF, they played a lot of backups, even early, but still... not really sure what is going on there.

[NDIrish]

I just finished watching (most) of the wake forest game and I have to say, Notre Dame really puzzles me.

First, the scariest part of their offense, to me, is the yac, the downfield blocking, the big receivers, and the downhill running. Those strengths are synergistic and scary — even if you limit the receivers at first, they are big, and they keep delivering blows, and soon, you don’t wanna tackle them anymore. Add that to a running game that hammers you and some textbook downfield blocking and stopping their offense late in the game with a tenderized defense feels daunting. I see ND pulling away from a lot of opponents late in games the way alabama did with Scarborough against washington in 2016.  No wonder Kelly is so eager to have a better pocket passer. It’s the complementary missing piece to a scary offense. If Stanford traditionally runs a smashmouth offense, this is a smashpass offense.

The weird part is their defense. I didn’t watch the Michigan game yet, but apparently they limited Michigan to one offensive touchdown. And then, even though wake forest didn’t score a lot, they made it into the red zone on five of their first six trips, and the first four in the first half. They missed two field goals, but they were in the red zone. If Stanford gets opportunities like those,  I think they do a much better job capitalizing. And then the run defense. Against wake forest, they seem to be too late for a fast running back, and they seemed vulnerable to slow-developing run plays, with a patient running back. Sound familiar?

But then, how did they limit Michigan to just one touchdown??? Which defense does Stanford play this weekend?

You are not the only one that they puzzle... haha.  With the offense, that has always been the hope of what this offense can do, but these receivers... are wildly inconsistent.  There is really some great talent there, they need to just start showing it every week.  They were their against michigan and wake forest, not so much the other games.

for the defense..  that has been what i have been seeing all year.  This supposedly "championship level" defense has gotten beat a lot.  Now, against, WF, they played a lot of backups, even early, but still... not really sure what is going on there.

[CardinalSagehen]

11 of 17 ESPN pundits are picking ND:
http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...game-picks

Nearly everyone predicts a close game.

[CardinalSagehen]

11 of 17 ESPN pundits are picking ND:
http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...game-picks

Nearly everyone predicts a close game.

[NDIrish]

11 of 17 ESPN pundits are picking ND:
http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...game-picks

Nearly everyone predicts a close game.

i agree, i could see a 27-30ish type of score

---

Any specific questions about this team outside of the QB? any first time travelers looking for tips?

Fans are paranoid about injuries on their teams. 

Stanford has four regulars out in WR Wedington, S Edwards, and OLBs Robinson and Toohill. And backup OL (or potential starting LG) Foster Sarell is also out. Stanford is getting back OL Hamilton, S Simmons, and RB Speights this week. Stanford fans were freaking out last week, but a little more sanguine this week.

What's the ND injury situation? ND fan freakout level?

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

[NDIrish]

11 of 17 ESPN pundits are picking ND:
http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...game-picks

Nearly everyone predicts a close game.

i agree, i could see a 27-30ish type of score

---

Any specific questions about this team outside of the QB? any first time travelers looking for tips?

Fans are paranoid about injuries on their teams. 

Stanford has four regulars out in WR Wedington, S Edwards, and OLBs Robinson and Toohill. And backup OL (or potential starting LG) Foster Sarell is also out. Stanford is getting back OL Hamilton, S Simmons, and RB Speights this week. Stanford fans were freaking out last week, but a little more sanguine this week.

What's the ND injury situation? ND fan freakout level?

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

[NDFacts]

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

I've been following along in this thread all week, and I can't take anymore from you. Crawford was not the starting Rover, he was the Nickle. Rover was, is, and has been Bilal. 

Kraemer has a sprained ankle which led to Rhuland getting his first start last week at RG, and the two could split time there this week. 

You are clearly using some bad facts when you talk about the passing defense. Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. Overall, the secondary is much better this year than last as we have Safeties making INTs, strips, etc. and being very active across the board to make tackles. Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. TO say the defense has been a let down is false.

[NDFacts]

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

I've been following along in this thread all week, and I can't take anymore from you. Crawford was not the starting Rover, he was the Nickle. Rover was, is, and has been Bilal. 

Kraemer has a sprained ankle which led to Rhuland getting his first start last week at RG, and the two could split time there this week. 

You are clearly using some bad facts when you talk about the passing defense. Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. Overall, the secondary is much better this year than last as we have Safeties making INTs, strips, etc. and being very active across the board to make tackles. Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. TO say the defense has been a let down is false.

[ChicagoCard]

This forum has been hijacked.

[ChicagoCard]

This forum has been hijacked.

[NDIrish]

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

I've been following along in this thread all week, and I can't take anymore from you. Crawford was not the starting Rover, he was the Nickle. Rover was, is, and has been Bilal. 

Kraemer has a sprained ankle which led to Rhuland getting his first start last week at RG, and the two could split time there this week. 

You are clearly using some bad facts when you talk about the passing defense. Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. Overall, the secondary is much better this year than last as we have Safeties making INTs, strips, etc. and being very active across the board to make tackles. Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. TO say the defense has been a let down is false.

Crawford would have played Rover as well.  Yes his true position as nickle, MY BAD FOR THIS MISTAKE!  The question was what was specific to ND's freakout level with injuries, Kraemer is likely to play most of the game and there is no freakout with Rhuland getting in there to substitute.

Yes Love is 5th was pass breakups, we are great at protecting against throwing it deep, but we are getting beat on shorter routes across the middle and at the edges- watch every game and it is there.   Yes Wake forest ran 92 plays and we only gave up 27, but we gave up 400 yards, 420 to vandy, 350 to ball state.  We are getting lucky with strong play in the red zone, Stanford will beat us in the redzone.  We are 65th in total defense and 76th in pass defense!  Where exactly i am getting bad facts?

My point was everyone talks about this defense being a championship level defense and i was saying that i don't see it yet.  Clemson - 3rd, Georgia 12- ohio State-25, Alabama - 26, those are championship level defenses.  ND has to fill some holes.

here are their rankings;
total defense - 65
rush defense - 62
pass defense - 76
scoring defense - 33
turnover margin - 29
red zone - 50

Where are my bad facts?  Yes i made a mistake with Shaun's position.  But his injury has been the only one to reach "freakout" level.  The rest have hurt some depth, but nothing anyone has been to worried about.

If you can't take what i have to say, then don't read.

---

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

I've been following along in this thread all week, and I can't take anymore from you. Crawford was not the starting Rover, he was the Nickle. Rover was, is, and has been Bilal. 

Kraemer has a sprained ankle which led to Rhuland getting his first start last week at RG, and the two could split time there this week. 

You are clearly using some bad facts when you talk about the passing defense. Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. Overall, the secondary is much better this year than last as we have Safeties making INTs, strips, etc. and being very active across the board to make tackles. Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. TO say the defense has been a let down is false.

Crawford would have played Rover as well.  Yes his true position as nickle, MY BAD FOR THIS MISTAKE!  The question was what was specific to ND's freakout level with injuries, Kraemer is likely to play most of the game and there is no freakout with Rhuland getting in there to substitute.

Yes Love is 5th was pass breakups, we are great at protecting against throwing it deep, but we are getting beat on shorter routes across the middle and at the edges- watch every game and it is there.   Yes Wake forest ran 92 plays and we only gave up 27, but we gave up 400 yards, 420 to vandy, 350 to ball state.  We are getting lucky with strong play in the red zone, Stanford will beat us in the redzone.  We are 65th in total defense and 76th in pass defense!  Where exactly i am getting bad facts?

My point was everyone talks about this defense being a championship level defense and i was saying that i don't see it yet.  Clemson - 3rd, Georgia 12- ohio State-25, Alabama - 26, those are championship level defenses.  ND has to fill some holes.

here are their rankings;
total defense - 65
rush defense - 62
pass defense - 76
scoring defense - 33
turnover margin - 29
red zone - 50

Where are my bad facts?  Yes i made a mistake with Shaun's position.  But his injury has been the only one to reach "freakout" level.  The rest have hurt some depth, but nothing anyone has been to worried about.

If you can't take what i have to say, then don't read.

sorry for that guys, last thing i want to do is come on here and argue with another ND Fan

[NDIrish]

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

I've been following along in this thread all week, and I can't take anymore from you. Crawford was not the starting Rover, he was the Nickle. Rover was, is, and has been Bilal. 

Kraemer has a sprained ankle which led to Rhuland getting his first start last week at RG, and the two could split time there this week. 

You are clearly using some bad facts when you talk about the passing defense. Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. Overall, the secondary is much better this year than last as we have Safeties making INTs, strips, etc. and being very active across the board to make tackles. Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. TO say the defense has been a let down is false.

Crawford would have played Rover as well.  Yes his true position as nickle, MY BAD FOR THIS MISTAKE!  The question was what was specific to ND's freakout level with injuries, Kraemer is likely to play most of the game and there is no freakout with Rhuland getting in there to substitute.

Yes Love is 5th was pass breakups, we are great at protecting against throwing it deep, but we are getting beat on shorter routes across the middle and at the edges- watch every game and it is there.   Yes Wake forest ran 92 plays and we only gave up 27, but we gave up 400 yards, 420 to vandy, 350 to ball state.  We are getting lucky with strong play in the red zone, Stanford will beat us in the redzone.  We are 65th in total defense and 76th in pass defense!  Where exactly i am getting bad facts?

My point was everyone talks about this defense being a championship level defense and i was saying that i don't see it yet.  Clemson - 3rd, Georgia 12- ohio State-25, Alabama - 26, those are championship level defenses.  ND has to fill some holes.

here are their rankings;
total defense - 65
rush defense - 62
pass defense - 76
scoring defense - 33
turnover margin - 29
red zone - 50

Where are my bad facts?  Yes i made a mistake with Shaun's position.  But his injury has been the only one to reach "freakout" level.  The rest have hurt some depth, but nothing anyone has been to worried about.

If you can't take what i have to say, then don't read.

---

ND is pretty healthy.  We have had a few injuries on the defensive side, mostly in 2nd/3rd string guys thankfully.  It hurts our depth a little, but nothing too bad.  Our biggest blow came the week before the michigan game to shaun crawford.  And that loss continues to be a blow to our rover position.  It has taken a rotation of guys to try and fill that spot and that weakens other areas.  Nothing significant on the offensive side.  We lost a TE for a couple weeks, but he should be back for this game.  So all in all, little freakout.

I've been following along in this thread all week, and I can't take anymore from you. Crawford was not the starting Rover, he was the Nickle. Rover was, is, and has been Bilal. 

Kraemer has a sprained ankle which led to Rhuland getting his first start last week at RG, and the two could split time there this week. 

You are clearly using some bad facts when you talk about the passing defense. Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. Overall, the secondary is much better this year than last as we have Safeties making INTs, strips, etc. and being very active across the board to make tackles. Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. TO say the defense has been a let down is false.

Crawford would have played Rover as well.  Yes his true position as nickle, MY BAD FOR THIS MISTAKE!  The question was what was specific to ND's freakout level with injuries, Kraemer is likely to play most of the game and there is no freakout with Rhuland getting in there to substitute.

Yes Love is 5th was pass breakups, we are great at protecting against throwing it deep, but we are getting beat on shorter routes across the middle and at the edges- watch every game and it is there.   Yes Wake forest ran 92 plays and we only gave up 27, but we gave up 400 yards, 420 to vandy, 350 to ball state.  We are getting lucky with strong play in the red zone, Stanford will beat us in the redzone.  We are 65th in total defense and 76th in pass defense!  Where exactly i am getting bad facts?

My point was everyone talks about this defense being a championship level defense and i was saying that i don't see it yet.  Clemson - 3rd, Georgia 12- ohio State-25, Alabama - 26, those are championship level defenses.  ND has to fill some holes.

here are their rankings;
total defense - 65
rush defense - 62
pass defense - 76
scoring defense - 33
turnover margin - 29
red zone - 50

Where are my bad facts?  Yes i made a mistake with Shaun's position.  But his injury has been the only one to reach "freakout" level.  The rest have hurt some depth, but nothing anyone has been to worried about.

If you can't take what i have to say, then don't read.

sorry for that guys, last thing i want to do is come on here and argue with another ND Fan

[ChicagoCard]

Larry Fedora says this forum is under attack.

[ChicagoCard]

Larry Fedora says this forum is under attack.

[CTcard]

Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. 

Love appears to be second in the nation in PBUs, and tied for third in passes defended. 
http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/nati...ort04.html 

The statement above is more or less (though not completely) contradictory. 
It is generally difficult to break up lots of passes when the other team does not throw your way. 

In Stanford's case, Paulson Adebo leads the nation in PBUs, which is at least partly because opposing teams have been throwing away from our other corner, Alijah Holder. 

Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. 

I did watch the und-Wake game tape. 
The und defense did give up a lot of yards without points, I don't know if that was by design. 
In the first half Wake had a 47 yd drive with a missed FG, a 54 yd drive for a FG, a 75 yd drive for a TD, and a 67 yd drive for a missed FG. 
That's 10 points (and 3 points on a zero yd drive FG), which is pretty good. 
That's also four long drives for 243 yds in a half, which I suspect your coaches were not thrilled about. 
Obviously there were some better notes as well. Several three and out type drives through the first half and third quarter. 

It also could be a concern if you allow a team to run 92 plays to your 76 (Wake); or 97 to your 72 (Ball St). Sometimes you have to be able to get your defense off the field. 
However, that is unlikely to be the pattern against Stanford this year, as Stanford seems to have somehow morphed into a big-play, boom or bust offense and not one that sustains long drives.

[CTcard]

Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. 

Love appears to be second in the nation in PBUs, and tied for third in passes defended. 
http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/nati...ort04.html 

The statement above is more or less (though not completely) contradictory. 
It is generally difficult to break up lots of passes when the other team does not throw your way. 

In Stanford's case, Paulson Adebo leads the nation in PBUs, which is at least partly because opposing teams have been throwing away from our other corner, Alijah Holder. 

Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. 

I did watch the und-Wake game tape. 
The und defense did give up a lot of yards without points, I don't know if that was by design. 
In the first half Wake had a 47 yd drive with a missed FG, a 54 yd drive for a FG, a 75 yd drive for a TD, and a 67 yd drive for a missed FG. 
That's 10 points (and 3 points on a zero yd drive FG), which is pretty good. 
That's also four long drives for 243 yds in a half, which I suspect your coaches were not thrilled about. 
Obviously there were some better notes as well. Several three and out type drives through the first half and third quarter. 

It also could be a concern if you allow a team to run 92 plays to your 76 (Wake); or 97 to your 72 (Ball St). Sometimes you have to be able to get your defense off the field. 
However, that is unlikely to be the pattern against Stanford this year, as Stanford seems to have somehow morphed into a big-play, boom or bust offense and not one that sustains long drives.

[NDIrish]

Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. 

Love appears to be second in the nation in PBUs, and tied for third in passes defended. 
http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/nati...ort04.html 

The statement above is more or less (though not completely) contradictory. 
It is generally difficult to break up lots of passes when the other team does not throw your way. 

In Stanford's case, Paulson Adebo leads the nation in PBUs, which is at least partly because opposing teams have been throwing away from our other corner, Alijah Holder. 

Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. 

I did watch the und-Wake game tape. 
The und defense did give up a lot of yards without points, I don't know if that was by design. 
In the first half Wake had a 47 yd drive with a missed FG, a 54 yd drive for a FG, a 75 yd drive for a TD, and a 67 yd drive for a missed FG. 
That's 10 points (and 3 points on a zero yd drive FG), which is pretty good. 
That's also four long drives for 243 yds in a half, which I suspect your coaches were not thrilled about. 
Obviously there were some better notes as well. Several three and out type drives through the first half and third quarter. 

It also could be an issue that to allow a team to run 92 plays to your 76; or 97 to your 72. Sometimes you have to be able to get your defense off the field. 
However, that is unlikely to be the pattern against Stanford this year, as Stanford seems to have somehow morphed into a big-play, boom or bust offense and not one that sustains long drives.

WF ran a ton of plays, and some of it was due to the efficiency of the offense on that day and it was a hot humid day, but people have been trying to compare this to the ND defense of 2012, which is just ridiculous. they have had this bend but dont break attitude, but largely because offenses have not had many weapons.  I am concerned that stanford will be able to break this defense in these situations.  Stanford has height, physicality, great backs and a great kicker. this defense will need to step it up to win.

[NDIrish]

Love is 5th in PBUs in the nation, and few teams are throwing his way. 

Love appears to be second in the nation in PBUs, and tied for third in passes defended. 
http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/nati...ort04.html 

The statement above is more or less (though not completely) contradictory. 
It is generally difficult to break up lots of passes when the other team does not throw your way. 

In Stanford's case, Paulson Adebo leads the nation in PBUs, which is at least partly because opposing teams have been throwing away from our other corner, Alijah Holder. 

Yeah Wake scored 27 points, but 14 of those were in garbage time after ND was up 42-13... oh and that was with Wake running 92 plays. They scored 1.93 points per drive. That's a fantastic stat line. Ball St. ran 96 plays and only scored 16 points. 

I did watch the und-Wake game tape. 
The und defense did give up a lot of yards without points, I don't know if that was by design. 
In the first half Wake had a 47 yd drive with a missed FG, a 54 yd drive for a FG, a 75 yd drive for a TD, and a 67 yd drive for a missed FG. 
That's 10 points (and 3 points on a zero yd drive FG), which is pretty good. 
That's also four long drives for 243 yds in a half, which I suspect your coaches were not thrilled about. 
Obviously there were some better notes as well. Several three and out type drives through the first half and third quarter. 

It also could be an issue that to allow a team to run 92 plays to your 76; or 97 to your 72. Sometimes you have to be able to get your defense off the field. 
However, that is unlikely to be the pattern against Stanford this year, as Stanford seems to have somehow morphed into a big-play, boom or bust offense and not one that sustains long drives.

WF ran a ton of plays, and some of it was due to the efficiency of the offense on that day and it was a hot humid day, but people have been trying to compare this to the ND defense of 2012, which is just ridiculous. they have had this bend but dont break attitude, but largely because offenses have not had many weapons.  I am concerned that stanford will be able to break this defense in these situations.  Stanford has height, physicality, great backs and a great kicker. this defense will need to step it up to win.

[ChicagoCard]

Just kidding, if anything the forum could use the extra activity.

[ChicagoCard]

Just kidding, if anything the forum could use the extra activity.

[NDIrish]

Just kidding, if anything the forum could use the extra activity.

ha yes, and i am good to go into a debate with Stanford fans, but getting in bickering match with a 1 post ND fan... not what i am here for.  ND has a pretty good team, but i am not going to be blinded into thinking they are playing at a level right now to succeed in the playoffs.  What i said was wrong, dont know what got into my mind, Shaun C is a true nickle and a big loss.

---

did not realize that this is the first time Stanford/ND have played where both are undefeated since 1925... pretty cool

[NDIrish]

Just kidding, if anything the forum could use the extra activity.

ha yes, and i am good to go into a debate with Stanford fans, but getting in bickering match with a 1 post ND fan... not what i am here for.  ND has a pretty good team, but i am not going to be blinded into thinking they are playing at a level right now to succeed in the playoffs.  What i said was wrong, dont know what got into my mind, Shaun C is a true nickle and a big loss.

---

did not realize that this is the first time Stanford/ND have played where both are undefeated since 1925... pretty cool

[NDIrish]

say the score ended up being 42-14, would you be more surprised if Stanford was on top or ND?

[NDIrish]

say the score ended up being 42-14, would you be more surprised if Stanford was on top or ND?

[stupac2]

say the score ended up being 42-14, would you be more surprised if Stanford was on top or ND?

I would be very surprised if it were that lopsided. I'm not sure I have enough of a feel for ND to be more surprised about either outcome though.

[stupac2]

say the score ended up being 42-14, would you be more surprised if Stanford was on top or ND?

I would be very surprised if it were that lopsided. I'm not sure I have enough of a feel for ND to be more surprised about either outcome though.

[Snorlax94]

Although I think Stanford will win, and I think it will be close (1 td or less), I wouldn’t be surprised if it were one-sided, either.

If Stanford finally gets its running game going the way it is capable of doing, they will be highly efficient, they will wear down their opponents, they will keep ND’s offense of the field, and they will score a lot. And I could see a big win.

If, in his second start, Book has a very limited offense that Stanford is well-prepared for, and Stanford is able to exploit him due to his limited experience (SC’s Darnold, who eventually became amazing, lost his first game badly, against a good Utah defense), I could see a big win.

If Stanford is injured worse than I know, their offense could be a mess and they may not be able to stop ND’s offense, and I could see a lopsided loss.

If Stanford is emotionally depleted after Oregon and simply is unable to re-charge between consecutive road games, the second being across the country, I could see them getting in big trouble.

If Stanford comes out flat again and keeps making errors and drive-killing penalties and gets into a deep hole again, Notre Dame will be far less forgiving than Oregon and things could snowball.

So yeah, there are so many unknowns (injuries, inconsistent play, an almost-rookie qb who had an outstanding debut — but against a very bad defense, an elite running game that vanished despite almost everyone returning), almost nothing would surprise me.

[Snorlax94]

Although I think Stanford will win, and I think it will be close (1 td or less), I wouldn’t be surprised if it were one-sided, either.

If Stanford finally gets its running game going the way it is capable of doing, they will be highly efficient, they will wear down their opponents, they will keep ND’s offense of the field, and they will score a lot. And I could see a big win.

If, in his second start, Book has a very limited offense that Stanford is well-prepared for, and Stanford is able to exploit him due to his limited experience (SC’s Darnold, who eventually became amazing, lost his first game badly, against a good Utah defense), I could see a big win.

If Stanford is injured worse than I know, their offense could be a mess and they may not be able to stop ND’s offense, and I could see a lopsided loss.

If Stanford is emotionally depleted after Oregon and simply is unable to re-charge between consecutive road games, the second being across the country, I could see them getting in big trouble.

If Stanford comes out flat again and keeps making errors and drive-killing penalties and gets into a deep hole again, Notre Dame will be far less forgiving than Oregon and things could snowball.

So yeah, there are so many unknowns (injuries, inconsistent play, an almost-rookie qb who had an outstanding debut — but against a very bad defense, an elite running game that vanished despite almost everyone returning), almost nothing would surprise me.

[hayaka]

say the score ended up being 42-14, would you be more surprised if Stanford was on top or ND?

A game between two erstwhile evenly-matched teams rarely ends with a blowout by the road team.  If the final score is 42-14, I'm pretty sure Notre Dame will have the 42.

[hayaka]

say the score ended up being 42-14, would you be more surprised if Stanford was on top or ND?

A game between two erstwhile evenly-matched teams rarely ends with a blowout by the road team.  If the final score is 42-14, I'm pretty sure Notre Dame will have the 42.

[NDIrish]

Alright, well i have not really had the time this week to go into specifics that i feel like we usually do, but thats ok.  I appreciate the welcome back i received.  Kind of a final breakdown with some revisions to my initial thoughts...

Special Teams - i think that from a kicking standpoint, Standford is more consistent.  But Notre Dame has some great kickers, just hoping they can lock down that consistency.  They have been better the last 2 games, so hopefully they have straightened it out.  Both teams have guys with brobdingnagian legs and that could be the difference in a game like this.  From a return standpoint, notre dame isn't too dangerous.  They can get an average return, but very much doubt it will be enough to change the game.  I think Stanford has some pretty decent returns, not sure if they will send Love back there again like they did against Oregon, but i doubt it.  I expecting kicking to play more of a role then returns in this game. - Tie

Notre Dame Defense/Stanford Offense - I have said it before, Notre Dame has to tighten up on the far end of the field, the bend don't break attitude won't work well in this game.  If Stanford gets in the red zone, odds are in their favor to come away with points.  I think the depth of our D-Line will help late in this game and allow us to get some pressure.  I am not sure how much they are going to want to blitz, because i think Costello is so good and getting the ball out quickly it would leave us too weak.  --Random thought, if Costello were to get injured, who does Stanford have behind him, doesn't look like he has registered any stats this year--  My guess would be, our DC will commit to stopping Bryce Love and push our corners to be as good as everyone says they are.  This isn't going to be a shutout, but more of a slow you down.  If our D-line can get pressure on their own, thats brobdingnagian.  I think we will see enough leaks to prevent Costello from having a Voldemort type day, but will give Stanford the edge.

Notre Dame Offense/Stanford Defense - Calling it now, Wimbush will be brought into this game to change things up, but Book starts and finishes it.  I think he will start slow, some incompletes and probably a pick early.  BW could come in a change things enough to keep the game close and then when Stanford adjusts to him, let Book come back and do his thing to end the game.  Sounds pretty ridiculous and a lot of switching, but just how i see it playing out.  Book throws a great ball, Wimbush has as much athletic ability as any dual threat QB i have seen in College.  If he could have the touch  Book has, he really could be something special, but he doesnt and thats why we are where we are.  I think our o line will struggle early and settle in.  Our running backs will stay fresh because we have like 13 of them now, lol.  Armstrong is the most exciting to watch, Tony Jones Jr is shifty, but he won't bring anything that Stanford doesnt see week in and week out.  I think our Tight Ends will get a bulk of the work and your corners try and limit anything over the top to Boykin and Claypool.  But, the golden man will be Chris Fink.  This is a game where i see him shinning (just a hunch) and that will be enough to give Notre Dame the edge.

Coaching - you know its funny, Kelly comes along and starts beating USC (something we hadn't done a lot of lately) but starts losing to stanford.  I think Shaw is good and figuring Kelly out.  Some people just have an ability to read certain people, and i think Shaw has that over Kelly.  We have had so many coaches leave recently for promotions elsewhere (ND wont fork over the $$ to keep them, ugh), i think Stanford has better cohesiveness among their coaches.  I gotta give Stanford the edge here.

X factors - ill kind of throw everything else in here and give ND  the checkmark.  I think with the game at home and Notre Dame has enough dynamic players to keep stanford on their toes. 

Injuries - kind of discussed earlier, i think Notre Dame depends less on fewer people, meaning we are relatively healthy now and our offense and defense don't revolve around one person.  we could suffer an injury along the o line, qb, receiver, running back, etc. and it would hurt, but we have capable and experienced people ready to go in, all of who have already seen playing time this year.  Our thinnest spot is at MLB, if Coney or Tranquill get hurt, a brobdingnagian hole opens up!

Weather looks good!

Special teams - tie
Stanford O/ND D - Stanford
ND O/Stanford D - Stanford
Coaching - Stanford
X factor - Notre Dame
Injuries - Notre Dame

Final prediction:
                    Q1    Q2      Q3   Q 4
Stanford        7      7        14    3    = 31
Notre Dame   7     10        7   10    = 34

Hope everyone traveling enjoys the game and are treated right by the locals.  Good luck!

---

Forgot to ask, is there an app to run this forum, if i wanted to comment during the game?  or a chat or anything that happens?

[NDIrish]

Alright, well i have not really had the time this week to go into specifics that i feel like we usually do, but thats ok.  I appreciate the welcome back i received.  Kind of a final breakdown with some revisions to my initial thoughts...

Special Teams - i think that from a kicking standpoint, Standford is more consistent.  But Notre Dame has some great kickers, just hoping they can lock down that consistency.  They have been better the last 2 games, so hopefully they have straightened it out.  Both teams have guys with brobdingnagian legs and that could be the difference in a game like this.  From a return standpoint, notre dame isn't too dangerous.  They can get an average return, but very much doubt it will be enough to change the game.  I think Stanford has some pretty decent returns, not sure if they will send Love back there again like they did against Oregon, but i doubt it.  I expecting kicking to play more of a role then returns in this game. - Tie

Notre Dame Defense/Stanford Offense - I have said it before, Notre Dame has to tighten up on the far end of the field, the bend don't break attitude won't work well in this game.  If Stanford gets in the red zone, odds are in their favor to come away with points.  I think the depth of our D-Line will help late in this game and allow us to get some pressure.  I am not sure how much they are going to want to blitz, because i think Costello is so good and getting the ball out quickly it would leave us too weak.  --Random thought, if Costello were to get injured, who does Stanford have behind him, doesn't look like he has registered any stats this year--  My guess would be, our DC will commit to stopping Bryce Love and push our corners to be as good as everyone says they are.  This isn't going to be a shutout, but more of a slow you down.  If our D-line can get pressure on their own, thats brobdingnagian.  I think we will see enough leaks to prevent Costello from having a Voldemort type day, but will give Stanford the edge.

Notre Dame Offense/Stanford Defense - Calling it now, Wimbush will be brought into this game to change things up, but Book starts and finishes it.  I think he will start slow, some incompletes and probably a pick early.  BW could come in a change things enough to keep the game close and then when Stanford adjusts to him, let Book come back and do his thing to end the game.  Sounds pretty ridiculous and a lot of switching, but just how i see it playing out.  Book throws a great ball, Wimbush has as much athletic ability as any dual threat QB i have seen in College.  If he could have the touch  Book has, he really could be something special, but he doesnt and thats why we are where we are.  I think our o line will struggle early and settle in.  Our running backs will stay fresh because we have like 13 of them now, lol.  Armstrong is the most exciting to watch, Tony Jones Jr is shifty, but he won't bring anything that Stanford doesnt see week in and week out.  I think our Tight Ends will get a bulk of the work and your corners try and limit anything over the top to Boykin and Claypool.  But, the golden man will be Chris Fink.  This is a game where i see him shinning (just a hunch) and that will be enough to give Notre Dame the edge.

Coaching - you know its funny, Kelly comes along and starts beating USC (something we hadn't done a lot of lately) but starts losing to stanford.  I think Shaw is good and figuring Kelly out.  Some people just have an ability to read certain people, and i think Shaw has that over Kelly.  We have had so many coaches leave recently for promotions elsewhere (ND wont fork over the $$ to keep them, ugh), i think Stanford has better cohesiveness among their coaches.  I gotta give Stanford the edge here.

X factors - ill kind of throw everything else in here and give ND  the checkmark.  I think with the game at home and Notre Dame has enough dynamic players to keep stanford on their toes. 

Injuries - kind of discussed earlier, i think Notre Dame depends less on fewer people, meaning we are relatively healthy now and our offense and defense don't revolve around one person.  we could suffer an injury along the o line, qb, receiver, running back, etc. and it would hurt, but we have capable and experienced people ready to go in, all of who have already seen playing time this year.  Our thinnest spot is at MLB, if Coney or Tranquill get hurt, a brobdingnagian hole opens up!

Weather looks good!

Special teams - tie
Stanford O/ND D - Stanford
ND O/Stanford D - Stanford
Coaching - Stanford
X factor - Notre Dame
Injuries - Notre Dame

Final prediction:
                    Q1    Q2      Q3   Q 4
Stanford        7      7        14    3    = 31
Notre Dame   7     10        7   10    = 34

Hope everyone traveling enjoys the game and are treated right by the locals.  Good luck!

---

Forgot to ask, is there an app to run this forum, if i wanted to comment during the game?  or a chat or anything that happens?