08-08-2019, 02:05 PM
CA HS Football Participation headed down
08-08-2019, 04:30 PM
(08-02-2019, 09:04 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(08-02-2019, 08:59 PM)Mick Wrote:(08-02-2019, 04:20 PM)Goose Wrote: One very big reason a lower percentage of kids try to play high school football today is that high school football is at least two orders of magnitude more "advanced" than it was in the 60's and 70's. The coaches are more professional, the kids have played lots of Pop Warner, they are bigger, they are faster, and they have had lots of coaching. Back in the day, most kids trying out for football had played a bit of sandlot, and that was it. Coaches would take warm bodies and keep them on the team because they needed practice players. Today, most kids in that category know they are not in the same class as the athletes that will actually play, so they don't bother trying out. If you are just "some guy", are you seriously going to try out for De La Salle or even Woodisde? I doubt it.
Along those lines, I noted that the size and weight of my son's freshman football team in 2006 was the same as my high school team in 1979.
True, but chances are that the mean weight of the freshman class in 2006 is comparable to that of the junior/senior class back in 1979.
BC
Completely anecdotal information--I've been walking the dog as I do every morning and the freshman football players have started showing up for their early morning practice. Man, they look really young and very small, even in their pads and cleats. The school typically has a pretty good team, and has had many Pac-12 players and a few pros, but man, these guys are smaller than some of the 12 year old girls my daughter swims against.
Free Phogge!!!! And no, crimson doesn't refer to the Tide.
(08-02-2019, 09:04 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(08-02-2019, 08:59 PM)Mick Wrote:(08-02-2019, 04:20 PM)Goose Wrote: One very big reason a lower percentage of kids try to play high school football today is that high school football is at least two orders of magnitude more "advanced" than it was in the 60's and 70's. The coaches are more professional, the kids have played lots of Pop Warner, they are bigger, they are faster, and they have had lots of coaching. Back in the day, most kids trying out for football had played a bit of sandlot, and that was it. Coaches would take warm bodies and keep them on the team because they needed practice players. Today, most kids in that category know they are not in the same class as the athletes that will actually play, so they don't bother trying out. If you are just "some guy", are you seriously going to try out for De La Salle or even Woodisde? I doubt it.
Along those lines, I noted that the size and weight of my son's freshman football team in 2006 was the same as my high school team in 1979.
True, but chances are that the mean weight of the freshman class in 2006 is comparable to that of the junior/senior class back in 1979.
BC
Completely anecdotal information--I've been walking the dog as I do every morning and the freshman football players have started showing up for their early morning practice. Man, they look really young and very small, even in their pads and cleats. The school typically has a pretty good team, and has had many Pac-12 players and a few pros, but man, these guys are smaller than some of the 12 year old girls my daughter swims against.
Free Phogge!!!! And no, crimson doesn't refer to the Tide.
08-10-2019, 11:46 PM
My son participated in Track and Field, Cross Country, Archery, Basketball, a touch of Tennis and 6 years of LL Baseball, but he never quit the Gymnastics he began at 3 years of age. About 75 kids get to move up to collegiate Men's Gymnastics each year. Keeping him in the same sport all of those years worked out. It isn't a sport you can quit and come back to later. If you quit for even 6 months once you enter puberty you will never get your flexibility back.
Actually, we didn't think he would be good enough to do it in college until he hit 10th grade. I just wanted him to learn to finish what he started, so during the tough times when he wasn't sure if he wanted to continue I pushed him to stick with it.
Actually, we didn't think he would be good enough to do it in college until he hit 10th grade. I just wanted him to learn to finish what he started, so during the tough times when he wasn't sure if he wanted to continue I pushed him to stick with it.
My son participated in Track and Field, Cross Country, Archery, Basketball, a touch of Tennis and 6 years of LL Baseball, but he never quit the Gymnastics he began at 3 years of age. About 75 kids get to move up to collegiate Men's Gymnastics each year. Keeping him in the same sport all of those years worked out. It isn't a sport you can quit and come back to later. If you quit for even 6 months once you enter puberty you will never get your flexibility back.
Actually, we didn't think he would be good enough to do it in college until he hit 10th grade. I just wanted him to learn to finish what he started, so during the tough times when he wasn't sure if he wanted to continue I pushed him to stick with it.
Actually, we didn't think he would be good enough to do it in college until he hit 10th grade. I just wanted him to learn to finish what he started, so during the tough times when he wasn't sure if he wanted to continue I pushed him to stick with it.
08-12-2019, 11:19 PM
(08-11-2019, 09:33 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Another reason...
https://apple.news/AtGp6Y77JQjaerfI5cbActA
Cost.
BC
$1500 a year on gymnastics? That's a joke. More like $1500 every 2 months. Minimum. I spent $15,000 his senior year.
(08-11-2019, 09:33 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Another reason...
https://apple.news/AtGp6Y77JQjaerfI5cbActA
Cost.
BC
$1500 a year on gymnastics? That's a joke. More like $1500 every 2 months. Minimum. I spent $15,000 his senior year.
08-13-2019, 11:07 AM
(08-12-2019, 11:19 PM)akiddoc Wrote:(08-11-2019, 09:33 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Another reason...
https://apple.news/AtGp6Y77JQjaerfI5cbActA
Cost.
BC
$1500 a year on gymnastics? That's a joke. More like $1500 every 2 months. Minimum. I spent $15,000 his senior year.
I spent about $8k -$10k annually for eight years, between club dues, fees, uniforms, travel, hotels, etc.
Audaces fortuna iuvat
(08-12-2019, 11:19 PM)akiddoc Wrote:(08-11-2019, 09:33 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Another reason...
https://apple.news/AtGp6Y77JQjaerfI5cbActA
Cost.
BC
$1500 a year on gymnastics? That's a joke. More like $1500 every 2 months. Minimum. I spent $15,000 his senior year.
I spent about $8k -$10k annually for eight years, between club dues, fees, uniforms, travel, hotels, etc.
Audaces fortuna iuvat
I think we were up to well over $15k a year by the time my daughter was at level 9 gymnastics. Probably more. And that was many years ago. Yes, there are certain sports that seem to be very class oriented--I'm not sure we ever saw a poor kid in gymnastics, which at the club level was overwhelmingly white and Asian. Ice skating is even more extreme.
Back to football, the Forbes article below outlines a series of reasons in addition to CTE (e.g., the rise of Lacrosse) but CTE (which is a much more serious concern than just concussions) is certainly a factor in every study of declining participation. As far as California and education levels--I think it proves the point. You hear about teams having problems in Marin county and on the Peninsula, not in the Central Valley. California is a very heterogeneous state, with some of the richest most highly educated communities, and some of the poorest more poorly educated communities that you will find anywhere in America.
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2019-02-b...tball.html
https://www.metrowestdailynews.com/news/...d-injuries
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/brea...story.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobcook/201...9b0d275408
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2726...ll-players
https://www.southcoasttoday.com/news/201...southcoast
Back to football, the Forbes article below outlines a series of reasons in addition to CTE (e.g., the rise of Lacrosse) but CTE (which is a much more serious concern than just concussions) is certainly a factor in every study of declining participation. As far as California and education levels--I think it proves the point. You hear about teams having problems in Marin county and on the Peninsula, not in the Central Valley. California is a very heterogeneous state, with some of the richest most highly educated communities, and some of the poorest more poorly educated communities that you will find anywhere in America.
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2019-02-b...tball.html
https://www.metrowestdailynews.com/news/...d-injuries
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/brea...story.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobcook/201...9b0d275408
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2726...ll-players
https://www.southcoasttoday.com/news/201...southcoast
I think we were up to well over $15k a year by the time my daughter was at level 9 gymnastics. Probably more. And that was many years ago. Yes, there are certain sports that seem to be very class oriented--I'm not sure we ever saw a poor kid in gymnastics, which at the club level was overwhelmingly white and Asian. Ice skating is even more extreme.
Back to football, the Forbes article below outlines a series of reasons in addition to CTE (e.g., the rise of Lacrosse) but CTE (which is a much more serious concern than just concussions) is certainly a factor in every study of declining participation. As far as California and education levels--I think it proves the point. You hear about teams having problems in Marin county and on the Peninsula, not in the Central Valley. California is a very heterogeneous state, with some of the richest most highly educated communities, and some of the poorest more poorly educated communities that you will find anywhere in America.
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2019-02-b...tball.html
https://www.metrowestdailynews.com/news/...d-injuries
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/brea...story.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobcook/201...9b0d275408
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2726...ll-players
https://www.southcoasttoday.com/news/201...southcoast
Back to football, the Forbes article below outlines a series of reasons in addition to CTE (e.g., the rise of Lacrosse) but CTE (which is a much more serious concern than just concussions) is certainly a factor in every study of declining participation. As far as California and education levels--I think it proves the point. You hear about teams having problems in Marin county and on the Peninsula, not in the Central Valley. California is a very heterogeneous state, with some of the richest most highly educated communities, and some of the poorest more poorly educated communities that you will find anywhere in America.
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2019-02-b...tball.html
https://www.metrowestdailynews.com/news/...d-injuries
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/brea...story.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bobcook/201...9b0d275408
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2726...ll-players
https://www.southcoasttoday.com/news/201...southcoast
08-13-2019, 02:39 PM
That's the great thing about my son liking ultimate. The "uniform" is a tie died t-shirt. Games are a step up from pick-up basketball. Tournaments are all one-day affairs driving distance away.
The flip side is he also likes golf, which is an expensive sport for obvious reasons, including the fact that he likes going to golf camp at Stanford.
BC
The flip side is he also likes golf, which is an expensive sport for obvious reasons, including the fact that he likes going to golf camp at Stanford.
BC
That's the great thing about my son liking ultimate. The "uniform" is a tie died t-shirt. Games are a step up from pick-up basketball. Tournaments are all one-day affairs driving distance away.
The flip side is he also likes golf, which is an expensive sport for obvious reasons, including the fact that he likes going to golf camp at Stanford.
BC
The flip side is he also likes golf, which is an expensive sport for obvious reasons, including the fact that he likes going to golf camp at Stanford.
BC
08-14-2019, 04:37 AM
Ike Salinda is a good example of a top golfer from a working class background (plus a really good kid)
08-27-2019, 02:25 PM
<p>
<!--StartFragment--><a href="https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/">https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/</a><!--EndFragment-->
<br></p><p><br></p>
Quote:<!--StartFragment--><p style="margin: 0px 0px 20px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; color: rgb(95, 91, 97); font-size: 14px; line-height: 25px; font-family: open_sansregular, sans-serif; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Participation in boys 11-player football declined by 30,829 participants to 1,006,013 – the lowest mark since 1,002,734 in the 1999-2000 school year.</p><p style="margin: 0px 0px 20px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; color: rgb(95, 91, 97); font-size: 14px; line-height: 25px; font-family: open_sansregular, sans-serif; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Although the actual number of participants in boys 11-player football dropped for the fifth consecutive year, the number of schools offering the sport remained steady. The survey indicated that 14,247 schools offer 11-player football – an increase of 168 from last year. A comparison of the figures from the past two years indicates that the average number of boys involved in 11-player football on a per-school basis dropped from 73 to 70, which would include freshman, junior varsity and varsity teams.</p><p style="margin: 0px 0px 20px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; color: rgb(95, 91, 97); font-size: 14px; line-height: 25px; font-family: open_sansregular, sans-serif; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">While participation in boys 11-player football dropped in all but seven states, participation in 6-player, 8-player and 9-player gained 156 schools and 1,594 participants nationwide, with the largest increase in boys 8-player football from 19,554 to 20,954. In addition, in the past 10 years, participation by girls in 11-player football has doubled – from 1,249 in the 2009-10 school year to 2,404 last year.</p><!--EndFragment--><br></p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment--><a href="https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/">https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/</a><!--EndFragment-->
<br></p><p><br></p>
Eric
"the older we get the better we were"
<p>
<!--StartFragment--><a href="https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/">https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/</a><!--EndFragment-->
<br></p><p><br></p>
Quote:<!--StartFragment--><p style="margin: 0px 0px 20px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; color: rgb(95, 91, 97); font-size: 14px; line-height: 25px; font-family: open_sansregular, sans-serif; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Participation in boys 11-player football declined by 30,829 participants to 1,006,013 – the lowest mark since 1,002,734 in the 1999-2000 school year.</p><p style="margin: 0px 0px 20px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; color: rgb(95, 91, 97); font-size: 14px; line-height: 25px; font-family: open_sansregular, sans-serif; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Although the actual number of participants in boys 11-player football dropped for the fifth consecutive year, the number of schools offering the sport remained steady. The survey indicated that 14,247 schools offer 11-player football – an increase of 168 from last year. A comparison of the figures from the past two years indicates that the average number of boys involved in 11-player football on a per-school basis dropped from 73 to 70, which would include freshman, junior varsity and varsity teams.</p><p style="margin: 0px 0px 20px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; color: rgb(95, 91, 97); font-size: 14px; line-height: 25px; font-family: open_sansregular, sans-serif; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">While participation in boys 11-player football dropped in all but seven states, participation in 6-player, 8-player and 9-player gained 156 schools and 1,594 participants nationwide, with the largest increase in boys 8-player football from 19,554 to 20,954. In addition, in the past 10 years, participation by girls in 11-player football has doubled – from 1,249 in the 2009-10 school year to 2,404 last year.</p><!--EndFragment--><br></p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment--><a href="https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/">https://www.nfhs.org/articles/participation-in-high-school-sports-registers-first-decline-in-30-years/</a><!--EndFragment-->
<br></p><p><br></p>
Eric
"the older we get the better we were"
09-01-2019, 08:13 AM
<p>As if there aren’t enough reasons for reduced participation, wait until kids find out that concussions are associated with lower testosterone and erectile dysfunction.</p><p><br></p><p>https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaneurology/fullarticle/2748920?guestAccessKey=027dd3ad-c2e6-4cf4-84c2-aeed5a0f0f6e&utm_content=weekly_highlights&utm_term=083119&utm_source=silverchair&utm_campaign=jama_network&cmp=1&utm_medium=email<br></p><p><br></p><p>BC</p>
<p>As if there aren’t enough reasons for reduced participation, wait until kids find out that concussions are associated with lower testosterone and erectile dysfunction.</p><p><br></p><p>https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaneurology/fullarticle/2748920?guestAccessKey=027dd3ad-c2e6-4cf4-84c2-aeed5a0f0f6e&utm_content=weekly_highlights&utm_term=083119&utm_source=silverchair&utm_campaign=jama_network&cmp=1&utm_medium=email<br></p><p><br></p><p>BC</p>
09-01-2019, 08:52 AM
<p>After looking forward to yesterday's game between Stanford and Northwestern for quite some time, I found myself very disheartened by the end of it as a result of all the significant injuries. For Stanford, there's KJ Costello's probable concussion and Walker Little's knee injury. Saw mention that Booker was hurt as well, but hopefully a time-limited problem.</p><p><br></p><p>For NWU, here's an entry from their fan forum site:</p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment-->"Let’s see: Green is likely out for the season following surgery (get well soon TJ!). No word yet on Slater, our LT and best OL. Bowser had to leave the game, but he was standing on his own on the
sideline during the second half. Also our captain Williams left and
never returned, although I think he walked off on his own power.</p><p>I wouldn’t be shocked if Whillock was playing hurt given how many tackles he whiffed on. Who else am I missing? This doesn’t include injuries from the preseason, which clearly hurt the superback position."<br>
</p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment-->Subsequent entries from other Northwestern posters suggest that only Green's is likely season-ending, but still quite a lot of not-trivial injuries.</p><p><br></p><p>Nothing really new, I realize, but getting harder for me to dismiss. And probably the same for kids who have become more aware of the long-term risks.<!--EndFragment--><br></p>
<!--StartFragment-->"Let’s see: Green is likely out for the season following surgery (get well soon TJ!). No word yet on Slater, our LT and best OL. Bowser had to leave the game, but he was standing on his own on the
sideline during the second half. Also our captain Williams left and
never returned, although I think he walked off on his own power.</p><p>I wouldn’t be shocked if Whillock was playing hurt given how many tackles he whiffed on. Who else am I missing? This doesn’t include injuries from the preseason, which clearly hurt the superback position."<br>
</p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment-->Subsequent entries from other Northwestern posters suggest that only Green's is likely season-ending, but still quite a lot of not-trivial injuries.</p><p><br></p><p>Nothing really new, I realize, but getting harder for me to dismiss. And probably the same for kids who have become more aware of the long-term risks.<!--EndFragment--><br></p>
<p>After looking forward to yesterday's game between Stanford and Northwestern for quite some time, I found myself very disheartened by the end of it as a result of all the significant injuries. For Stanford, there's KJ Costello's probable concussion and Walker Little's knee injury. Saw mention that Booker was hurt as well, but hopefully a time-limited problem.</p><p><br></p><p>For NWU, here's an entry from their fan forum site:</p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment-->"Let’s see: Green is likely out for the season following surgery (get well soon TJ!). No word yet on Slater, our LT and best OL. Bowser had to leave the game, but he was standing on his own on the
sideline during the second half. Also our captain Williams left and
never returned, although I think he walked off on his own power.</p><p>I wouldn’t be shocked if Whillock was playing hurt given how many tackles he whiffed on. Who else am I missing? This doesn’t include injuries from the preseason, which clearly hurt the superback position."<br>
</p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment-->Subsequent entries from other Northwestern posters suggest that only Green's is likely season-ending, but still quite a lot of not-trivial injuries.</p><p><br></p><p>Nothing really new, I realize, but getting harder for me to dismiss. And probably the same for kids who have become more aware of the long-term risks.<!--EndFragment--><br></p>
<!--StartFragment-->"Let’s see: Green is likely out for the season following surgery (get well soon TJ!). No word yet on Slater, our LT and best OL. Bowser had to leave the game, but he was standing on his own on the
sideline during the second half. Also our captain Williams left and
never returned, although I think he walked off on his own power.</p><p>I wouldn’t be shocked if Whillock was playing hurt given how many tackles he whiffed on. Who else am I missing? This doesn’t include injuries from the preseason, which clearly hurt the superback position."<br>
</p><p><br></p><p>
<!--StartFragment-->Subsequent entries from other Northwestern posters suggest that only Green's is likely season-ending, but still quite a lot of not-trivial injuries.</p><p><br></p><p>Nothing really new, I realize, but getting harder for me to dismiss. And probably the same for kids who have become more aware of the long-term risks.<!--EndFragment--><br></p>
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