[82lsju]

Stanford: The reality is starting to sink in. Stanford is back to being mediocre at football. It has been a pretty incredible run of consistency for the Cardinal with 10 straight winning seasons and a couple flirtations with the national championship race. But year by year, the aura of Stanford football has started to fade into a place where you just don't know what you're going to get from week to week. Stanford's opportunity to get a win at Colorado slipped away when the Buffs went 61 yards in 13 plays and hit a 37-yard field goal at the buzzer for a 16-13 win. Stanford is 4-5 and needs to win at Washington State next week in the worst way. But there’s a bigger question for the program. Once the hot name for nearly every big job, nobody talks much about David Shaw anymore. But is it getting so difficult to maintain excellence at Stanford that he finally starts looking around for something different after nine years at his alma mater?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/co...hotline-nl

[82lsju]

Stanford: The reality is starting to sink in. Stanford is back to being mediocre at football. It has been a pretty incredible run of consistency for the Cardinal with 10 straight winning seasons and a couple flirtations with the national championship race. But year by year, the aura of Stanford football has started to fade into a place where you just don't know what you're going to get from week to week. Stanford's opportunity to get a win at Colorado slipped away when the Buffs went 61 yards in 13 plays and hit a 37-yard field goal at the buzzer for a 16-13 win. Stanford is 4-5 and needs to win at Washington State next week in the worst way. But there’s a bigger question for the program. Once the hot name for nearly every big job, nobody talks much about David Shaw anymore. But is it getting so difficult to maintain excellence at Stanford that he finally starts looking around for something different after nine years at his alma mater?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/co...hotline-nl

[teejers1]

That last sentence is hilarious.  On so many fronts.

[teejers1]

That last sentence is hilarious.  On so many fronts.

[qwerty49]

The definition of mediocrity is when “trending toward misery” includes 2 of this year’s opponents and we are 1-1 against them.

[qwerty49]

The definition of mediocrity is when “trending toward misery” includes 2 of this year’s opponents and we are 1-1 against them.

[BostonCard]

I thought the last section rang very familiar:

TOTALLY REAL AND IRRATIONAL MESSAGE BOARD THREADS 
“0% chance this staff can get us where we want to be” - The Big Spur (South Carolina)
“I’m glad we fulfilled our yearly duty to the Vols" - Cats Illustrated
“Does Dantonio still get a statue?" - Spartan Tailgate
“We have reached the abyss" - Vandymania
"Heupel is not the answer" - UCFSports.com

Surprised there were no quotes from this message board.

BC

[BostonCard]

I thought the last section rang very familiar:

TOTALLY REAL AND IRRATIONAL MESSAGE BOARD THREADS 
“0% chance this staff can get us where we want to be” - The Big Spur (South Carolina)
“I’m glad we fulfilled our yearly duty to the Vols" - Cats Illustrated
“Does Dantonio still get a statue?" - Spartan Tailgate
“We have reached the abyss" - Vandymania
"Heupel is not the answer" - UCFSports.com

Surprised there were no quotes from this message board.

BC

[JohnR34231]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits. Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there.

[JohnR34231]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits. Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there.

[winflop]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits. Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there.

There are very few programs in the country where this does not apply, and for those few programs, coaches get poached for promotional opportunities. That means that recruits can't count on their position coach being there in two years.

Pretty clear things are not working right now at Stanford. The lingering question is whether Shaw is willing to make the substantive changes that are needed. If he isn't, then it may not be his choice whether to stay or go after a couple more seasons like this one. I have no doubt he sees the problems. The question is whether he's willing to do what's necessary to prevent their recurrence.

Leaders make mistakes. Good leaders learn from them and take steps to not repeat them.

[winflop]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits. Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there.

There are very few programs in the country where this does not apply, and for those few programs, coaches get poached for promotional opportunities. That means that recruits can't count on their position coach being there in two years.

Pretty clear things are not working right now at Stanford. The lingering question is whether Shaw is willing to make the substantive changes that are needed. If he isn't, then it may not be his choice whether to stay or go after a couple more seasons like this one. I have no doubt he sees the problems. The question is whether he's willing to do what's necessary to prevent their recurrence.

Leaders make mistakes. Good leaders learn from them and take steps to not repeat them.

[OutsiderFan]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits. Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there.

There are very few programs in the country where this does not apply, and for those few programs, coaches get poached for promotional opportunities. That means that recruits can't count on their position coach being there in two years.

Pretty clear things are not working right now at Stanford. The lingering question is whether Shaw is willing to make the substantive changes that are needed. If he isn't, then it may not be his choice whether to stay or go after a couple more seasons like this one. I have no doubt he sees the problems. The question is whether he's willing to do what's necessary to prevent their recurrence.

Leaders make mistakes. Good leaders learn from them and take steps to not repeat them.

This is the absolute truth.  It is EXCEEDINGLY RARE for a college coach to retire of his own volition, when and where he wants. This is why the saying "there are two types of coaches, ones who have been fired and ones not fired yet" exists. Bear Bryant did it. Joe Paterno did it. Frank Beamer did it.  Bobby Bowden did it. Bob Stoops did it. Maybe you could say Urban Meyer. This may not be an exhaustive list but there are precious few who finish out at one place compared to the number of head coaches there are in Power 5.

It is stunning to me how many Stanford fans adopt a "he's the winningest coach in program history so his current best is the best we can do for ourselves" mentality.  Phillip Fulmer, Mack Brown, and Les Miles were fired from Tennessee Texas, and LSU respectively, all after winning a National Championship, and their programs declined as Stanford's appears to be under Shaw now.

There are so many changes that need to be made. They are brought up here pretty frequently, so no need to waste time calling them out. I'll leave with this though...

I watched Clemson clown NC State for a half on Saturday night. In final minute of half with Clemson leading 42-0, NC State was driving and had the ball in the red zone. A bad snap resulted in a NCS fumble Clemson recovered.  The coaches reacted on the sidelines like they just won the National Championship. When you have that mentality it gets applied to all aspects of the program and you see the results on the field.

[OutsiderFan]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits. Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there.

There are very few programs in the country where this does not apply, and for those few programs, coaches get poached for promotional opportunities. That means that recruits can't count on their position coach being there in two years.

Pretty clear things are not working right now at Stanford. The lingering question is whether Shaw is willing to make the substantive changes that are needed. If he isn't, then it may not be his choice whether to stay or go after a couple more seasons like this one. I have no doubt he sees the problems. The question is whether he's willing to do what's necessary to prevent their recurrence.

Leaders make mistakes. Good leaders learn from them and take steps to not repeat them.

This is the absolute truth.  It is EXCEEDINGLY RARE for a college coach to retire of his own volition, when and where he wants. This is why the saying "there are two types of coaches, ones who have been fired and ones not fired yet" exists. Bear Bryant did it. Joe Paterno did it. Frank Beamer did it.  Bobby Bowden did it. Bob Stoops did it. Maybe you could say Urban Meyer. This may not be an exhaustive list but there are precious few who finish out at one place compared to the number of head coaches there are in Power 5.

It is stunning to me how many Stanford fans adopt a "he's the winningest coach in program history so his current best is the best we can do for ourselves" mentality.  Phillip Fulmer, Mack Brown, and Les Miles were fired from Tennessee Texas, and LSU respectively, all after winning a National Championship, and their programs declined as Stanford's appears to be under Shaw now.

There are so many changes that need to be made. They are brought up here pretty frequently, so no need to waste time calling them out. I'll leave with this though...

I watched Clemson clown NC State for a half on Saturday night. In final minute of half with Clemson leading 42-0, NC State was driving and had the ball in the red zone. A bad snap resulted in a NCS fumble Clemson recovered.  The coaches reacted on the sidelines like they just won the National Championship. When you have that mentality it gets applied to all aspects of the program and you see the results on the field.

[Hulk01]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

[Hulk01]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

[winflop]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

[winflop]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

[slide]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

well, per last week's presser, we at least know our coaches are well-rested and the coaches now know in-season recruiting is not a priority for the head coach.

[slide]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

well, per last week's presser, we at least know our coaches are well-rested and the coaches now know in-season recruiting is not a priority for the head coach.

[winflop]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

well, per last week's presser, we at least know our coaches are well-rested and the coaches now know in-season recruiting is not a priority for the head coach.

Link to presser? I missed it. Also looking for a link to postgame presser from Saturday.

[winflop]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

well, per last week's presser, we at least know our coaches are well-rested and the coaches now know in-season recruiting is not a priority for the head coach.

Link to presser? I missed it. Also looking for a link to postgame presser from Saturday.

[cardcrimson]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

well, per last week's presser, we at least know our coaches are well-rested and the coaches now know in-season recruiting is not a priority for the head coach.

Really funny if it weren't true.

[cardcrimson]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

well, per last week's presser, we at least know our coaches are well-rested and the coaches now know in-season recruiting is not a priority for the head coach.

Really funny if it weren't true.

[Row80Critic]

I've seen almost every home game since the 1970 season (still hate Purdue), give or take a few funerals and weddings.  It's my considered opinion that the 2019 Stanford Football program just ain't that good.  Stagnant coaching, limited player development, questionable offense and defensive schemes, inconsistent execution, severe injury and depth problems, no real play-makers, inexperienced  assistant coaches, everything about the PAC-12 Network, etc., and the band only plays the good songs at Homecoming.  They even ran out of lids for my Coke at the last game.  It's a program that could use a good kick in the pants by the University.  In the meantime, the team needs its fans more than ever, so get out there and be heard.  History says we have to be patient and look forward to the emergence of the next Walsh, Plunkett, Elway, Nelson, McCaffery, etc.   This too shall pass. :)

[Row80Critic]

I've seen almost every home game since the 1970 season (still hate Purdue), give or take a few funerals and weddings.  It's my considered opinion that the 2019 Stanford Football program just ain't that good.  Stagnant coaching, limited player development, questionable offense and defensive schemes, inconsistent execution, severe injury and depth problems, no real play-makers, inexperienced  assistant coaches, everything about the PAC-12 Network, etc., and the band only plays the good songs at Homecoming.  They even ran out of lids for my Coke at the last game.  It's a program that could use a good kick in the pants by the University.  In the meantime, the team needs its fans more than ever, so get out there and be heard.  History says we have to be patient and look forward to the emergence of the next Walsh, Plunkett, Elway, Nelson, McCaffery, etc.   This too shall pass. :)

[teejers1]

. . . and the band only plays the good songs at Homecoming.  

ROW80, were you by any chance in the group of fans in the Old Lady that sat WAY UP on the sunny side, and then during the LSJUMB's post-game playing would always request "Yellow River!"?

Those guys were great!

[teejers1]

. . . and the band only plays the good songs at Homecoming.  

ROW80, were you by any chance in the group of fans in the Old Lady that sat WAY UP on the sunny side, and then during the LSJUMB's post-game playing would always request "Yellow River!"?

Those guys were great!

[Row80Critic]

. . . and the band only plays the good songs at Homecoming.  

ROW80, were you by any chance in the group of fans in the Old Lady that sat WAY UP on the sunny side, and then during the LSJUMB's post-game playing would always request "Yellow River!"?

Those guys were great!

WAY UP? Like Row 80 maybe ;)  All I can say is... wait for it... Yellow River!!!

[Row80Critic]

. . . and the band only plays the good songs at Homecoming.  

ROW80, were you by any chance in the group of fans in the Old Lady that sat WAY UP on the sunny side, and then during the LSJUMB's post-game playing would always request "Yellow River!"?

Those guys were great!

WAY UP? Like Row 80 maybe ;)  All I can say is... wait for it... Yellow River!!!

[d4cohn]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

Well, the poor recruiting at the position occurred under the previous OL coach (now at Rice). Based on how the frosh OL have played compared to the upperclassmen even, I have more confidence that the current OL coach is improving on the problem (the same way DL was a problem under the previous DL coach that the current DL coach needed a couple of recruiting classes to fix). 

And technically as well, Coach Shaw did make a change in the S&C department too (albeit under very different circumstances). There, it seems the new S&C leadership is performing worse than previously in terms of injury prevention.

So those are three examples to me that Coach Shaw is willing to make changes (perhaps the quibble can be at what pace are those changes being made, and are they made promptly enough before they become a bigger problem). But I don't see these instances as Coach Shaw won't make changes even if he sees a problem out of loyalty or something.

[d4cohn]

Our offensive line has a combined three years of college football experience.

OK Hulk, but why is that? Injuries which over the past two season have exploded compared to the previous decade. Poor recruiting at the position that left us with seven guys on the two-deep to start the season. Also, this doesn't have anything to do with overhyped WRs & TEs who can't get separation, safeties who can't tackle and are out of position too often, and a complete lack of ILB depth. Throw in a head coach who churns out "Remain Calm, All Is Well" propaganda while throwing his players under the bus and you have a recipe for continued failure if significant changes aren't made.

Well, the poor recruiting at the position occurred under the previous OL coach (now at Rice). Based on how the frosh OL have played compared to the upperclassmen even, I have more confidence that the current OL coach is improving on the problem (the same way DL was a problem under the previous DL coach that the current DL coach needed a couple of recruiting classes to fix). 

And technically as well, Coach Shaw did make a change in the S&C department too (albeit under very different circumstances). There, it seems the new S&C leadership is performing worse than previously in terms of injury prevention.

So those are three examples to me that Coach Shaw is willing to make changes (perhaps the quibble can be at what pace are those changes being made, and are they made promptly enough before they become a bigger problem). But I don't see these instances as Coach Shaw won't make changes even if he sees a problem out of loyalty or something.

[Phogge]

Why be sad that the program is close to tanking? Why be sad about anything except losing family and friends and sick people. Pissed off is Ok but man this is just football.

[Phogge]

Why be sad that the program is close to tanking? Why be sad about anything except losing family and friends and sick people. Pissed off is Ok but man this is just football.

[Believer]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits.Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there”.

 

The recruits thank you for this message Message to recruits. “Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there”.  No $#// Sherlock. Same applies to every recruit everywhere. Same for your message to coaches. Thanks for the recruiting help, the future card with elite backgrounds and futures don’t give a truck what you think. Thank goodness. 

[Believer]

Speaking for myself, I don't find much humor in the current situation.
Message to future coaches. When you have some success at Stanford you better get out because that success will be fleeting.
Message to recruits.Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there”.

 

The recruits thank you for this message Message to recruits. “Just because Stanford has been successful in the past doesn't mean it will be when you get there”.  No $#// Sherlock. Same applies to every recruit everywhere. Same for your message to coaches. Thanks for the recruiting help, the future card with elite backgrounds and futures don’t give a truck what you think. Thank goodness. 

[BostonCard]

Why be sad that the program is close to tanking? Why be sad about anything except losing family and friends and sick people. Pissed off is Ok but man this is just football.

Indeed.  It is obviously more fun to follow a team that is dominating, but yeah, it's just football.  The great thing about sports is that no matter the misery, after the season ends, hope can spring (or you can get excited about pitchers and catchers reporting).

BC

[BostonCard]

Why be sad that the program is close to tanking? Why be sad about anything except losing family and friends and sick people. Pissed off is Ok but man this is just football.

Indeed.  It is obviously more fun to follow a team that is dominating, but yeah, it's just football.  The great thing about sports is that no matter the misery, after the season ends, hope can spring (or you can get excited about pitchers and catchers reporting).

BC

[needle]

Based on how the frosh OL have played compared to the upperclassmen even, I have more confidence that the current OL coach is improving on the problem (the same way DL was a problem under the previous DL coach that the current DL coach needed a couple of recruiting classes to fix).

I don't know enough to grade Carberry on how good he is at teaching technique/scheme. But if we've noticed the frosh O-linemen are legit players, I'm a little worried some other program is going to pay big bucks to lure him away. A good recruiter--assuming Carberry recruits the linemen--always gets plenty of attention in the college game.

[needle]

Based on how the frosh OL have played compared to the upperclassmen even, I have more confidence that the current OL coach is improving on the problem (the same way DL was a problem under the previous DL coach that the current DL coach needed a couple of recruiting classes to fix).

I don't know enough to grade Carberry on how good he is at teaching technique/scheme. But if we've noticed the frosh O-linemen are legit players, I'm a little worried some other program is going to pay big bucks to lure him away. A good recruiter--assuming Carberry recruits the linemen--always gets plenty of attention in the college game.