[Papa John]

CTCard, 2013 and 2018 were rated poorly because of the overall numbers. It's not easy to sort talent level using 247sports team rankings, so I'm going to use Rivals instead. In terms of average star rating per recruit, here's how Stanford's recruiting classes since 2010 stack up:

2010: 3.14 #28 nationally
2011: 3.32 #17
2012: 3.73 #4
2013: 3.33 #17
2014: 3.45 #14
2015: 3.27 #20
2016: 3.16 #23
2017: 3.93 #3
2018: 3.2 #26
2019: 3.24 #25
2020: 3.35 #18
2021 (so far): 2.93 #48

SamuelMcF confirmed there's still hope for a few more in the class: Moore (3-star), Dubre (3), Kendall (4), Maro (3) and Uke (3). Given such a low staring point, there's room for improvement but it's hard to imagine even approaching the high-20s nationally in terms of average stars.

On the other hand, the 2008 recruiting class had a Rivals average-star rating of 2.71, #45 nationally. That class featured the following players who at least signed with an NFL team:
2-star Johnson Bademosi
2-star Alex Debniak
2-star Daniel Zychlinski
2-star Padric Scott (he transferred to Florida A&M)
3-star Jonathan Martin
3-star Chase Thomas
3-star Michael Thomas
3-star Delano Howell
4-star Andrew Luck
4-star Christopher Owusu
3-star David Decastro

[Papa John]

CTCard, 2013 and 2018 were rated poorly because of the overall numbers. It's not easy to sort talent level using 247sports team rankings, so I'm going to use Rivals instead. In terms of average star rating per recruit, here's how Stanford's recruiting classes since 2010 stack up:

2010: 3.14 #28 nationally
2011: 3.32 #17
2012: 3.73 #4
2013: 3.33 #17
2014: 3.45 #14
2015: 3.27 #20
2016: 3.16 #23
2017: 3.93 #3
2018: 3.2 #26
2019: 3.24 #25
2020: 3.35 #18
2021 (so far): 2.93 #48

SamuelMcF confirmed there's still hope for a few more in the class: Moore (3-star), Dubre (3), Kendall (4), Maro (3) and Uke (3). Given such a low staring point, there's room for improvement but it's hard to imagine even approaching the high-20s nationally in terms of average stars.

On the other hand, the 2008 recruiting class had a Rivals average-star rating of 2.71, #45 nationally. That class featured the following players who at least signed with an NFL team:
2-star Johnson Bademosi
2-star Alex Debniak
2-star Daniel Zychlinski
2-star Padric Scott (he transferred to Florida A&M)
3-star Jonathan Martin
3-star Chase Thomas
3-star Michael Thomas
3-star Delano Howell
4-star Andrew Luck
4-star Christopher Owusu
3-star David Decastro

[Phogge]

DeCastro my be one of the best 3 star guys ever.

[Phogge]

DeCastro my be one of the best 3 star guys ever.

[CTcard]

Certainly part of what made the 2013 and 2018 classes poor was the small numbers, particularly 2013. One problem with 2021 is that it is also small, at least so far. I included the average player ratings from 247 for that reason. The Rivals average stars rating is too coarse to be very meaningful - almost all players are distributed between two numbers. An average of their "rating" would be better, but they don't provide that automatically in their tables. 

If one cared enough you could dig through the services numbers and come out with a better comparison of how they rate the classes. That would not be fruitful, because there just isn't enough information in the rankings to justify the work.

The broad story persists - as of this time it appears that 2021 is one of Shaw's poorest classes but exactly where it rates depends upon both how it finishes and how the players turn out (presumably related to how good a job the staff has done in evaluations).

CTCard, 2013 and 2018 were rated poorly because of the overall numbers. It's not easy to sort talent level using 247sports team rankings, so I'm going to use Rivals instead. In terms of average star rating per recruit, here's how Stanford's recruiting classes since 2010 stack up:



2010: 3.14 #28 nationally

2011: 3.32 #17

2012: 3.73 #4

2013: 3.33 #17

2014: 3.45 #14

2015: 3.27 #20

2016: 3.16 #23

2017: 3.93 #3

2018: 3.2 #26

2019: 3.24 #25

2020: 3.35 #18

2021 (so far): 2.93 #48



SamuelMcF confirmed there's still hope for a few more in the class: Moore (3-star), Dubre (3), Kendall (4), Maro (3) and Uke (3). Given such a low staring point, there's room for improvement but it's hard to imagine even approaching the high-20s nationally in terms of average stars.



On the other hand, the 2008 recruiting class had a Rivals average-star rating of 2.71, #45 nationally. That class featured the following players who at least signed with an NFL team:

2-star Johnson Bademosi

2-star Alex Debniak

2-star Daniel Zychlinski

2-star Padric Scott (he transferred to Florida A&M)

3-star Jonathan Martin

3-star Chase Thomas

3-star Michael Thomas

3-star Delano Howell

4-star Andrew Luck

4-star Christopher Owusu

3-star David Decastro

[CTcard]

Certainly part of what made the 2013 and 2018 classes poor was the small numbers, particularly 2013. One problem with 2021 is that it is also small, at least so far. I included the average player ratings from 247 for that reason. The Rivals average stars rating is too coarse to be very meaningful - almost all players are distributed between two numbers. An average of their "rating" would be better, but they don't provide that automatically in their tables. 

If one cared enough you could dig through the services numbers and come out with a better comparison of how they rate the classes. That would not be fruitful, because there just isn't enough information in the rankings to justify the work.

The broad story persists - as of this time it appears that 2021 is one of Shaw's poorest classes but exactly where it rates depends upon both how it finishes and how the players turn out (presumably related to how good a job the staff has done in evaluations).

CTCard, 2013 and 2018 were rated poorly because of the overall numbers. It's not easy to sort talent level using 247sports team rankings, so I'm going to use Rivals instead. In terms of average star rating per recruit, here's how Stanford's recruiting classes since 2010 stack up:



2010: 3.14 #28 nationally

2011: 3.32 #17

2012: 3.73 #4

2013: 3.33 #17

2014: 3.45 #14

2015: 3.27 #20

2016: 3.16 #23

2017: 3.93 #3

2018: 3.2 #26

2019: 3.24 #25

2020: 3.35 #18

2021 (so far): 2.93 #48



SamuelMcF confirmed there's still hope for a few more in the class: Moore (3-star), Dubre (3), Kendall (4), Maro (3) and Uke (3). Given such a low staring point, there's room for improvement but it's hard to imagine even approaching the high-20s nationally in terms of average stars.



On the other hand, the 2008 recruiting class had a Rivals average-star rating of 2.71, #45 nationally. That class featured the following players who at least signed with an NFL team:

2-star Johnson Bademosi

2-star Alex Debniak

2-star Daniel Zychlinski

2-star Padric Scott (he transferred to Florida A&M)

3-star Jonathan Martin

3-star Chase Thomas

3-star Michael Thomas

3-star Delano Howell

4-star Andrew Luck

4-star Christopher Owusu

3-star David Decastro

[BostonCard]

Not to further dump on this class, but not only is it small, poorly rated, but it also doesn't do a great job addressing pressing needs.

BC

[BostonCard]

Not to further dump on this class, but not only is it small, poorly rated, but it also doesn't do a great job addressing pressing needs.

BC

[SamuelMcF]

Not to further dump on this class, but not only is it small, poorly rated, but it also doesn't do a great job addressing pressing needs.

BC

Disagree to an extent. DL and S were both massive needs, and we're signing 3 each. If we sign Dubre, ILB has something. OLB is the only really bad one.

I expect we're going for 2 ILBs and OLBs in 2022.

One other piece to consider is that the 2020 class will still have all eligibility left after this season, so you can somewhat treat 2020+2021 as one super-class.

[SamuelMcF]

Not to further dump on this class, but not only is it small, poorly rated, but it also doesn't do a great job addressing pressing needs.

BC

Disagree to an extent. DL and S were both massive needs, and we're signing 3 each. If we sign Dubre, ILB has something. OLB is the only really bad one.

I expect we're going for 2 ILBs and OLBs in 2022.

One other piece to consider is that the 2020 class will still have all eligibility left after this season, so you can somewhat treat 2020+2021 as one super-class.

[BostonCard]

3 S is helpful.
3 DL leaves us more or less where we were before.
As you pointed out elsewhere we are looking at a 2 year drought on LB, and even if we do sign Dubre, 1 LB in two years is really bad.

Our seniors getting an extra year of eligibility may or may not help.  If Schaffer, Booker, Johnson and DWP stay, we'll be ok.  But the transfer portal beckons, and recently we've had a number of players leave who would have gotten playing time with eligibility left.

BC

[BostonCard]

3 S is helpful.
3 DL leaves us more or less where we were before.
As you pointed out elsewhere we are looking at a 2 year drought on LB, and even if we do sign Dubre, 1 LB in two years is really bad.

Our seniors getting an extra year of eligibility may or may not help.  If Schaffer, Booker, Johnson and DWP stay, we'll be ok.  But the transfer portal beckons, and recently we've had a number of players leave who would have gotten playing time with eligibility left.

BC

[BobK]

I’m a broken record but at the start of the summer almost practices we had 83 on scholarship. So we had room for two who transferred. Period.

[BobK]

I’m a broken record but at the start of the summer almost practices we had 83 on scholarship. So we had room for two who transferred. Period.

[Phogge]

Booker is a true junior I believe.

[Phogge]

Booker is a true junior I believe.

[BostonCard]

You are right Phogge; Booker should be back barring something unusual.

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

BC

[BostonCard]

You are right Phogge; Booker should be back barring something unusual.

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

BC

[SamuelMcF]

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

Wait, who did we bring back in lieu of the DL grad transfers, who were the only players at "positions of greater need" that left?

[SamuelMcF]

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

Wait, who did we bring back in lieu of the DL grad transfers, who were the only players at "positions of greater need" that left?

[BostonCard]

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

Wait, who did we bring back in lieu of the DL grad transfers, who were the only players at "positions of greater need" that left?

Dorian Maddox

Treyjohn Butler (especially because Adebo was looking like he was coming back)

Former walk-on JJ Parson



BC

[BostonCard]

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

Wait, who did we bring back in lieu of the DL grad transfers, who were the only players at "positions of greater need" that left?

Dorian Maddox

Treyjohn Butler (especially because Adebo was looking like he was coming back)

Former walk-on JJ Parson



BC

[SamuelMcF]

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

Wait, who did we bring back in lieu of the DL grad transfers, who were the only players at "positions of greater need" that left?

Dorian Maddox

Treyjohn Butler (especially because Adebo was looking like he was coming back)

Former walk-on JJ Parson



BC

Maddox was expected to contribute - as he had been for 2 seasons - before injury. 

Parson was expected to contribute on defense too, as he had been for 2 seasons (the fact that he isn't is actually a good thing). He and Butler both still play on multiple STs.

I think I misunderstood your point originally.

[SamuelMcF]

Bob, the question is not how many of the players with eligibility remaining came back, but which ones came back.  There were some players who were starters or playing at positions of greater need who went into the transfer portal, and consequently we brought back some players who weren't anticipated to contribute.

Wait, who did we bring back in lieu of the DL grad transfers, who were the only players at "positions of greater need" that left?

Dorian Maddox

Treyjohn Butler (especially because Adebo was looking like he was coming back)

Former walk-on JJ Parson



BC

Maddox was expected to contribute - as he had been for 2 seasons - before injury. 

Parson was expected to contribute on defense too, as he had been for 2 seasons (the fact that he isn't is actually a good thing). He and Butler both still play on multiple STs.

I think I misunderstood your point originally.

[BostonCard]

My point was that two defensive linemen who would have been starters transferred out, and instead we had a few guys who were "expected to contribute".  On top of that we had a couple offensive linemen who might have been starters and a QB who really could have helped us against Oregon.

Just because we had 83 guys on scholarship didn't mean that we couldn't have had a better mix of 85 scholarship players and that the transfer portal didn't hurt us.

BC

[BostonCard]

My point was that two defensive linemen who would have been starters transferred out, and instead we had a few guys who were "expected to contribute".  On top of that we had a couple offensive linemen who might have been starters and a QB who really could have helped us against Oregon.

Just because we had 83 guys on scholarship didn't mean that we couldn't have had a better mix of 85 scholarship players and that the transfer portal didn't hurt us.

BC

[CTcard]

My point was that two defensive linemen who would have been starters transferred out,

Made me wonder how those guys are doing.

Mike Williams at SMU.
He's appeared in 7 of 10 games, started 3.
On the season 3 solo tackles, 3 assist tackles, no sacks, no TFL.

Jovan Swann at Indiana
He's appeared in 7 of 7 games, started 1.
On the season 2 solo tackles, 2 assist tackles, no sacks, no TFL.

[CTcard]

My point was that two defensive linemen who would have been starters transferred out,

Made me wonder how those guys are doing.

Mike Williams at SMU.
He's appeared in 7 of 10 games, started 3.
On the season 3 solo tackles, 3 assist tackles, no sacks, no TFL.

Jovan Swann at Indiana
He's appeared in 7 of 7 games, started 1.
On the season 2 solo tackles, 2 assist tackles, no sacks, no TFL.

[Phogge]

So not so much.

[Phogge]

So not so much.

[CTcard]

So not so much.

Yeah I guess so.

About 10-11 months ago there was much talk that this would be the first year that our grad transfers really have significant success elsewhere. Doesn't seemed to have happened much with Costello, Williams and Swann.
I believe that Hattis has started the two games that ASU has managed to play (0-2). I haven't watched so cannot tell how he has performed.
I think Hamilton has been the regular RT for Duke (2-8). Again have not watched.
Eboh has been starting cb for UCLA (3-2). He hasn't racked up many stats (19 tackles, no INTs or PBUs) - but from what I have read seems to be their #2 CB.
Speights went to Notre Dame but wasn't medically cleared.

Given a combination of how well guys are playing this year and needs at Stanford, it may be that Eboh is the one who might have helped the most had he stayed.

[CTcard]

So not so much.

Yeah I guess so.

About 10-11 months ago there was much talk that this would be the first year that our grad transfers really have significant success elsewhere. Doesn't seemed to have happened much with Costello, Williams and Swann.
I believe that Hattis has started the two games that ASU has managed to play (0-2). I haven't watched so cannot tell how he has performed.
I think Hamilton has been the regular RT for Duke (2-8). Again have not watched.
Eboh has been starting cb for UCLA (3-2). He hasn't racked up many stats (19 tackles, no INTs or PBUs) - but from what I have read seems to be their #2 CB.
Speights went to Notre Dame but wasn't medically cleared.

Given a combination of how well guys are playing this year and needs at Stanford, it may be that Eboh is the one who might have helped the most had he stayed.

[BobK]

Powell starts for Indiana

[BobK]

Powell starts for Indiana

[SamuelMcF]

Hattis was ASU's worst-graded starter in both of ASU's games.

Powell has been up and down; most recently in the Wisconsin game he was the worst-graded player on the whole offense regardless of snap count.

Eboh, though starting, plays roughly half of UCLA's snaps and has been likewise up and down. He has zero ints, zero PBUs, and has allowed catches on 13/16 targets. I don't know how much that would've helped us. Would rather have the young guys getting snaps there.

[SamuelMcF]

Hattis was ASU's worst-graded starter in both of ASU's games.

Powell has been up and down; most recently in the Wisconsin game he was the worst-graded player on the whole offense regardless of snap count.

Eboh, though starting, plays roughly half of UCLA's snaps and has been likewise up and down. He has zero ints, zero PBUs, and has allowed catches on 13/16 targets. I don't know how much that would've helped us. Would rather have the young guys getting snaps there.

[CTcard]

Hattis was ASU's worst-graded starter in both of ASU's games.



Powell has been up and down; most recently in the Wisconsin game he was the worst-graded player on the whole offense regardless of snap count.



Eboh, though starting, plays roughly half of UCLA's snaps and has been likewise up and down. He has zero ints, zero PBUs, and has allowed catches on 13/16 targets. I don't know how much that would've helped us. Would rather have the young guys getting snaps there.

For several of the OL guys, the move worked out in giving them more opportunity to play football.
For Stanford, there's not much to be pining for beyond some speculative what-might-have-beens.

[CTcard]

Hattis was ASU's worst-graded starter in both of ASU's games.



Powell has been up and down; most recently in the Wisconsin game he was the worst-graded player on the whole offense regardless of snap count.



Eboh, though starting, plays roughly half of UCLA's snaps and has been likewise up and down. He has zero ints, zero PBUs, and has allowed catches on 13/16 targets. I don't know how much that would've helped us. Would rather have the young guys getting snaps there.

For several of the OL guys, the move worked out in giving them more opportunity to play football.
For Stanford, there's not much to be pining for beyond some speculative what-might-have-beens.

[Phogge]

Hope all the transfers are enjoying their surroundings.

Stanford is 2-2. With those guys they would be 2-2. None were difference makers and kids got playing time which may pay off next year.

[Phogge]

Hope all the transfers are enjoying their surroundings.

Stanford is 2-2. With those guys they would be 2-2. None were difference makers and kids got playing time which may pay off next year.