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RE: 2022 Giants thread - lex24 - 04-07-2022
(04-07-2022, 03:09 PM)DC 86 Wrote:(04-07-2022, 02:21 PM)lex24 Wrote: Athletic had an interesting article about how the Cubs wooed Suzuki. Wonder what the Giants did. I placed their failure to sign a long term FA squarely on ownership not willing to come up with the money. I still do. The other possibility is harder to accept and that is that Zaidi and Company cannot close on a big deal.
Zaidi was part of closing plenty of deals in LA, which leads me to conclude that the difference is budget/ownership. The Dodgers have been smart but opportunistically aggressive in the Guggenheim era, a model that the Giants could follow but have chosen not to. As a capitalist I can't begrudge ownership maximizing profits, but it's disappointing for fans, and it surprises me that fans praise the Giants as if it were their money being saved.
The money issue is polluted by WAR. I keep reading people say, why sign X when he is only ___WAR. As if there is an actual correlation to WAR and the number of extra wins that player will bring. Put another way, do you think the Giants win 103 games without Posey in ‘21. His WAR was 3.5. I place his actual value last year at about 20 games. At least.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Phogge - 04-07-2022
There is already a disconnect between the principle owner and the City his club plays in.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - BostonCard - 04-07-2022
(04-07-2022, 05:14 PM)lex24 Wrote:(04-07-2022, 03:09 PM)DC 86 Wrote:(04-07-2022, 02:21 PM)lex24 Wrote: Athletic had an interesting article about how the Cubs wooed Suzuki. Wonder what the Giants did. I placed their failure to sign a long term FA squarely on ownership not willing to come up with the money. I still do. The other possibility is harder to accept and that is that Zaidi and Company cannot close on a big deal.
Zaidi was part of closing plenty of deals in LA, which leads me to conclude that the difference is budget/ownership. The Dodgers have been smart but opportunistically aggressive in the Guggenheim era, a model that the Giants could follow but have chosen not to. As a capitalist I can't begrudge ownership maximizing profits, but it's disappointing for fans, and it surprises me that fans praise the Giants as if it were their money being saved.
The money issue is polluted by WAR. I keep reading people say, why sign X when he is only ___WAR. As if there is an actual correlation to WAR and the number of extra wins that player will bring. Put another way, do you think the Giants win 103 games without Posey in ‘21. His WAR was 3.5. I place his actual value last year at about 20 games. At least.
No, they would have won 103.5 games, LOL.
BC
RE: 2022 Giants thread - cardcrimson - 04-07-2022
(04-07-2022, 05:14 PM)lex24 Wrote: Put another way, do you think the Giants win 103 games without Posey in ‘21. His WAR was 3.5. I place his actual value last year at about 20 games. At least.
Casali had a great win loss record last year (the stat doesn't readily pop up for me), and a WAR of .7. So, as Posey was his replacement, what does that mean? I think I remember a quote about stats that you posted awhile ago. . . .
RE: 2022 Giants thread - OutsiderFan - 04-08-2022
The RiverCats - who sucked last year - have started 3-0, with Ramos 1/4 in each of first three games.
Sean Hjelle went 3.2 scoreless in Thursday win. He likely will make his MLB debut this season. He might pass Randy Johnson for tallest Pitcher in Giants history, as he is 6-11 to Johnson's 6-10.
On the topic of Farm System, the High A Eugene Emeralds are lllloooaaadddeeeedddd. Will be watching to see how many of the top prospects starting out on that team get promoted to AA Richmond this year.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Mick - 04-08-2022
(04-07-2022, 02:21 PM)lex24 Wrote: Athletic had an interesting article about how the Cubs wooed Suzuki. Wonder what the Giants did. I placed their failure to sign a long term FA squarely on ownership not willing to come up with the money. I still do. The other possibility is harder to accept and that is that Zaidi and Company cannot close on a big deal.
My take on Zaidi is that he and his staff are extremely risk averse with respect to paying older players, but will embrace risk for younger players. Maybe not the worst place to be, especially after a 107 win season. I think Bryant won't age well, that contract will be an albatross soon. He has the kind of long swing that the Giants don't like...as does Joey Bart, btw.
(04-07-2022, 08:42 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(04-07-2022, 05:14 PM)lex24 Wrote: Put another way, do you think the Giants win 103 games without Posey in ‘21. His WAR was 3.5. I place his actual value last year at about 20 games. At least.
Casali had a great win loss record last year (the stat doesn't readily pop up for me), and a WAR of .7. So, as Posey was his replacement, what does that mean? I think I remember a quote about stats that you posted awhile ago. . . .
I don't know how Casali finished out. But in mid August, he was 33-9 as a starting catcher. He also caught four or five shutouts in a row, matching a 120 year old MLB record.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - lex24 - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 07:35 AM)Mick Wrote:(04-07-2022, 02:21 PM)lex24 Wrote: Athletic had an interesting article about how the Cubs wooed Suzuki. Wonder what the Giants did. I placed their failure to sign a long term FA squarely on ownership not willing to come up with the money. I still do. The other possibility is harder to accept and that is that Zaidi and Company cannot close on a big deal.
My take on Zaidi is that he and his staff are extremely risk averse with respect to paying older players, but will embrace risk for younger players. Maybe not the worst place to be, especially after a 107 win season. I think Bryant won't age well, that contract will be an albatross soon. He has the kind of long swing that the Giants don't like...as does Joey Bart, btw.
(04-07-2022, 08:42 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(04-07-2022, 05:14 PM)lex24 Wrote: Put another way, do you think the Giants win 103 games without Posey in ‘21. His WAR was 3.5. I place his actual value last year at about 20 games. At least.
Casali had a great win loss record last year (the stat doesn't readily pop up for me), and a WAR of .7. So, as Posey was his replacement, what does that mean? I think I remember a quote about stats that you posted awhile ago. . . .
I don't know how Casali finished out. But in mid August, he was 33-9 as a starting catcher. He also caught four or five shutouts in a row, matching a 120 year old MLB record.
Yes, he did a nice job as Busters backup. And still, Buster was, imo, worth about 20 games last year.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Phogge - 04-08-2022
Eugene has the system's best prospects. Luciano, Harrison, Pomares, Toribio, Matos and a supposedly corrected Seth Corry.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - lex24 - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 09:51 AM)Phogge Wrote: Eugene has the system's best prospects. Luciano, Harrison, Pomares, Toribio, Matos and a supposedly corrected Seth Corry.
Hopefully only for part of the year. Want to see some move up to Richmond.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - DC 86 - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 07:35 AM)Mick Wrote: My take on Zaidi is that he and his staff are extremely risk averse with respect to paying older players, but will embrace risk for younger players. Maybe not the worst place to be, especially after a 107 win season. I think Bryant won't age well, that contract will be an albatross soon. He has the kind of long swing that the Giants don't like...as does Joey Bart, btw.
Fair enough, and reasonable to be wary of older players. Nobody is arguing for a seven year contract for Bryant.
But here are high end free agents that were available this off season:
Corey Seager (27)
Trevor Story (29)
Javier Baez (28)
Carlos Correa (27)
Seiya Suzuki (27)
There are arguments against signing each of these players, but they're all under 30, and other than Seager they all signed for only 3-6 years. The Giants were not involved at all on three and came up well short on the other two. So I don't see evidence of willingness to embrace risk for younger players.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - old spanish trail - 04-08-2022
Cast your vote for when we might see Tommy Listella this season. I'm saying June 1. He couldn't trot out to the third baseline for player intro. He walked...slowly. I'd like to be wrong, but this is the second year I consider him a $10 mill mistake. That was the $$, wasn't it?
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Phogge - 04-08-2022
And Joey Bart goes deep.... REAL deep.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Mick - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 03:13 PM)Phogge Wrote: And Joey Bart goes deep.... REAL deep.
414 feet, great HR, on a hanging slider.
Slater, pinch-hitting, went to 2-0, then struck out on three nasty sliders.
Webb looking good. Current lead 3-0 in the sixth.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - DC 86 - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 02:35 PM)old spanish trail Wrote: Cast your vote for when we might see Tommy Listella this season. I'm saying June 1. He couldn't trot out to the third baseline for player intro. He walked...slowly. I'd like to be wrong, but this is the second year I consider him a $10 mill mistake. That was the $$, wasn't it?
La Stella's contract is backloaded; he makes $5.25 million this year, but will make $11.5 million next year. Only once in his career has he posted bWAR above 0.6 (1.9 back in 2019). Even if his achilles isn't torn, an injury in that area doesn't sound good.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - old spanish trail - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 03:38 PM)DC 86 Wrote:(04-08-2022, 02:35 PM)old spanish trail Wrote: Cast your vote for when we might see Tommy Listella this season. I'm saying June 1. He couldn't trot out to the third baseline for player intro. He walked...slowly. I'd like to be wrong, but this is the second year I consider him a $10 mill mistake. That was the $$, wasn't it?
La Stella's contract is backloaded; he makes $5.25 million this year, but will make $11.5 million next year. Only once in his career has he posted bWAR above 0.6 (1.9 back in 2019). Even if his achilles isn't torn, an injury in that area doesn't sound good.
Oooof, worse than I thought. Fortunately, Farhan stole Estrada from the Yankees. I think he will shine this year or next.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - lex24 - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 03:13 PM)Phogge Wrote: And Joey Bart goes deep.... REAL deep.
Had a Three True Outcome day. Walk, HR, K. Perfect modern line…. Good to see him get first HR out of way quick. He does have power.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Phogge - 04-08-2022
Doval loses the lead and Estrada ties it up in the bottom 9th.
Brebbia starting the 10th with the inherited runner (horseshit).
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Mick - 04-08-2022
(04-08-2022, 04:42 PM)Phogge Wrote: Doval loses the lead and Estrada ties it up in the bottom 9th.
Brebbia starting the 10th with the inherited runner (horseshit).
Alvarez, three outside changeups, one strikeout. Now the Giants' turn.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - chrisk - 04-08-2022
Slater gets his first walk-off hit.
RE: 2022 Giants thread - Phogge - 04-08-2022
Lex, just 79 more wins to make you happy.