[winflop]

At the risk of promoting thread drift, the Matt Miller big board I noted also includes some positional rankings. No Stanford players in his Top 32, but in addition to Herbig as the #5 guard, he has Bryce Love as his #5 RB, JJAW as his #7 WR, and Kaden Smith as his #3 TE.  

Is Smith for sure leaving? If he is, looks like he's a Day 2 pick as well. But a good year next year would put him in Round 1, so there's value in staying.

Most draft boards I've seen put Smith as the #2 or #3 TE. That's day 1 for sure and at #2 it's potentially first round.

---

Apparently Bobbb and I agree on Herbig. No loss at all. Adios. Plus Powell has been loyal and has played well.

Did either of you not see how big the dropoff was when he was out? Herbig may not be a high draft pick but the guys behind him wouldn't even get UDFA contracts. Hopefully his backups improve a lot in the offseason. The gap was significant.

As for loyalty, Herbig was loyal too...until he wasn't.

---

Twitter is weird, but I counted three teammates who seemed to respond supportively to Herbig's Twitter announcement. If they seem to support him, as a fan I see no reason not to wish him luck in the future and hope that he does complete his degree (despite the weird grumbling I'm seeing in this thread).

Absolutely meaningless. They're not going to publicly throw him under the bus on his way out. And why do you think that we, as fans, have to align with his teammates' views?

I wish him luck in the future and hope he completes his degree for his own sake, but I'd prefer he did it somewhere else.

---

They had plenty of snaps and St. Brown has been around for two years. A vet. Plus he's been running routes since he could walk in that family with his dad and brothers. And I was referring to Costello, sorry for the un-Stanford grad use of the language.

I was referring to this statement:

I don’t care if Butter was sub par in the State title game. He was spot-on on the last drive to win. He has had an outstanding year against very good competition. Shaw needs two QB’s next year even if McKee doesn’t pull a Taysom Hill. If there is a better option OK. The kid wants to come, is a QB legacy.

Next year we will have three QB's: Costello, Mills, and West; McKee doesn't count as he'll still be on his mission.  There is downside risk of two QB's if Costello leaves early for the NFL or Mills is injured.  The danger the following year is that even if Costello stays this year (likely) he may well be gone in 2021.  We would still have at least two QB's between Mills, West, and McKee coming back from a mission, but of course there is the possibility that Mills is injured and McKee doesn't come back.

I agree that having Butterfield in the mix would be good, regardless, given that we don't have a 2020 QB.  But it doesn't help us for next year.

BC

The problem with not have a QB in this year's class isn't next year. Any incoming QB is going to redshirt - pretty much like every QB before him under Shaw. He's repeatedly stated that it takes a QB at least a year and more likely two years to develop a sufficient mastery of the offense to lead the team to a successful season.

The problem is in 2020 when Costello is gone. You have Mills - who has had how many surgeries now? - and West and Richardson (if he stays for a fifth year as a backup). After that it's a true frosh in McKee and walk-ons. With QB being such a high-risk position (injury and development), that's a depth chart that's too thin.

[winflop]

At the risk of promoting thread drift, the Matt Miller big board I noted also includes some positional rankings. No Stanford players in his Top 32, but in addition to Herbig as the #5 guard, he has Bryce Love as his #5 RB, JJAW as his #7 WR, and Kaden Smith as his #3 TE.  

Is Smith for sure leaving? If he is, looks like he's a Day 2 pick as well. But a good year next year would put him in Round 1, so there's value in staying.

Most draft boards I've seen put Smith as the #2 or #3 TE. That's day 1 for sure and at #2 it's potentially first round.

---

Apparently Bobbb and I agree on Herbig. No loss at all. Adios. Plus Powell has been loyal and has played well.

Did either of you not see how big the dropoff was when he was out? Herbig may not be a high draft pick but the guys behind him wouldn't even get UDFA contracts. Hopefully his backups improve a lot in the offseason. The gap was significant.

As for loyalty, Herbig was loyal too...until he wasn't.

---

Twitter is weird, but I counted three teammates who seemed to respond supportively to Herbig's Twitter announcement. If they seem to support him, as a fan I see no reason not to wish him luck in the future and hope that he does complete his degree (despite the weird grumbling I'm seeing in this thread).

Absolutely meaningless. They're not going to publicly throw him under the bus on his way out. And why do you think that we, as fans, have to align with his teammates' views?

I wish him luck in the future and hope he completes his degree for his own sake, but I'd prefer he did it somewhere else.

---

They had plenty of snaps and St. Brown has been around for two years. A vet. Plus he's been running routes since he could walk in that family with his dad and brothers. And I was referring to Costello, sorry for the un-Stanford grad use of the language.

I was referring to this statement:

I don’t care if Butter was sub par in the State title game. He was spot-on on the last drive to win. He has had an outstanding year against very good competition. Shaw needs two QB’s next year even if McKee doesn’t pull a Taysom Hill. If there is a better option OK. The kid wants to come, is a QB legacy.

Next year we will have three QB's: Costello, Mills, and West; McKee doesn't count as he'll still be on his mission.  There is downside risk of two QB's if Costello leaves early for the NFL or Mills is injured.  The danger the following year is that even if Costello stays this year (likely) he may well be gone in 2021.  We would still have at least two QB's between Mills, West, and McKee coming back from a mission, but of course there is the possibility that Mills is injured and McKee doesn't come back.

I agree that having Butterfield in the mix would be good, regardless, given that we don't have a 2020 QB.  But it doesn't help us for next year.

BC

The problem with not have a QB in this year's class isn't next year. Any incoming QB is going to redshirt - pretty much like every QB before him under Shaw. He's repeatedly stated that it takes a QB at least a year and more likely two years to develop a sufficient mastery of the offense to lead the team to a successful season.

The problem is in 2020 when Costello is gone. You have Mills - who has had how many surgeries now? - and West and Richardson (if he stays for a fifth year as a backup). After that it's a true frosh in McKee and walk-ons. With QB being such a high-risk position (injury and development), that's a depth chart that's too thin.