[Mick]

Answer my questions and I'll answer yours.

I guess my opinion is somewhat biased, but not for the reasons you think. I'm the dad of a 14 year old cisgender female, who is working really hard to be a better athlete. She is finally getting to be pretty competitive at her sports at the levels in which she is competing, and has set some pretty ambitious, but achievable goals. Both of her chosen sports are separated by gender, where the males are traditionally much better than the females. So theoretically, a transgender female could come along and derail those goals, as happened to the girls running track in Connecticut. Extrapolating that across sports where such a large advantage can be gained, I would come down on the side that competitions should be held on a biological basis.

And no, I don't think the vast majority of these transgender kids are transitioning just for the glory of high school sports. That said, I don't think they should get an advantage in sports just because they are, either.

Advantage in sport (and its affect on participation) is a funny thing.  

When I was in high school, I went out for football, broke my arm on the third day of practice, didn't play the rest of the year.  Eight months later, I was working on the Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk, with the guy who broke my arm (defensive end, I was WR, he piled me into the ground).  He had zits up and down his arms, back and face, and thinning hair and a physique that was -- well, let's just say I'd never seen one like it.  

We got to be friendly, and he showed me the Dianabol that he'd been taking to bulk up.  And about a month into the summer, we received a panicky nighttime call from our store down at the other end of the boardwalk about some intimidating gang members in the store (not uncommon in the 1970s). We went down in the electric cart that allowed us to transport items, we stopped at the store, and he "cleared the store" beating the crap out of two of the guys in the store, very savage.  My first and last experience with 'roid rage.  I just stayed out of the way.

Right at that moment, I made the decision not to play football any more.  I didn't want to go up against a 'roided-out athlete who was clearly my superior. 

Is it the point to encourage participation in sports against athletes who have chemically-induced advantages?  Not from my vantage point.

---

You know what else is unfair?  Being born just before the age cutoff and thus being the youngest in one’s team.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why...es-a-star/

BC

True. There's also the penchant for parents "redshirting" kindergarteners in the hopes that their little darling would grow to become a stellar athlete. Looking at my wife's and my athletic ability, we had no dreams of that and sent our daughter to kindergarten even with a late October birthday; socially and academically she was ready.

Lo and behold, as a freshman she was competing against girls 5 years older than she, and girls in her class are 18 months older. Her thoughts? She wouldn't change it--just makes her tougher. . . .

You may not see it, but you put her at an academic disadvantage by putting her in Kindergarten at 4 yo. Every academic paper on the subject shows it.

+1,000,000.  

I started school at the normal age, but was skipped a grade, completing third and fourth grade in the same year.  My father-in-law had the same miserable experience.  We both started our senior year in high school as 16 year olds.  The disparity in maturity and capability between boys who are a year apart is beyond significant.  And we both agreed that if there were one decision in our lives we could have back, it would be that one, for all the obvious reasons.

My oldest son was born September 10, and yes, the cutoff was September 1.  My wife, blissfully unaware of the disadvantages faced by the youngest male in any sociological group insisted that he start school a year early to avoid an admissions bubble at our favored grammar school. And he would have turned out "fine" in the way that "fine" is used and considered by any husband who says his wife's dress looks "fine."

I haven't won many battles with my lovely bride over the past 30+ years, but I won that one because I dug in like a tick.  And the kid turned out fantastic, believe you me, much better than he otherwise would have.

[Mick]

Answer my questions and I'll answer yours.

I guess my opinion is somewhat biased, but not for the reasons you think. I'm the dad of a 14 year old cisgender female, who is working really hard to be a better athlete. She is finally getting to be pretty competitive at her sports at the levels in which she is competing, and has set some pretty ambitious, but achievable goals. Both of her chosen sports are separated by gender, where the males are traditionally much better than the females. So theoretically, a transgender female could come along and derail those goals, as happened to the girls running track in Connecticut. Extrapolating that across sports where such a large advantage can be gained, I would come down on the side that competitions should be held on a biological basis.

And no, I don't think the vast majority of these transgender kids are transitioning just for the glory of high school sports. That said, I don't think they should get an advantage in sports just because they are, either.

Advantage in sport (and its affect on participation) is a funny thing.  

When I was in high school, I went out for football, broke my arm on the third day of practice, didn't play the rest of the year.  Eight months later, I was working on the Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk, with the guy who broke my arm (defensive end, I was WR, he piled me into the ground).  He had zits up and down his arms, back and face, and thinning hair and a physique that was -- well, let's just say I'd never seen one like it.  

We got to be friendly, and he showed me the Dianabol that he'd been taking to bulk up.  And about a month into the summer, we received a panicky nighttime call from our store down at the other end of the boardwalk about some intimidating gang members in the store (not uncommon in the 1970s). We went down in the electric cart that allowed us to transport items, we stopped at the store, and he "cleared the store" beating the crap out of two of the guys in the store, very savage.  My first and last experience with 'roid rage.  I just stayed out of the way.

Right at that moment, I made the decision not to play football any more.  I didn't want to go up against a 'roided-out athlete who was clearly my superior. 

Is it the point to encourage participation in sports against athletes who have chemically-induced advantages?  Not from my vantage point.

---

You know what else is unfair?  Being born just before the age cutoff and thus being the youngest in one’s team.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why...es-a-star/

BC

True. There's also the penchant for parents "redshirting" kindergarteners in the hopes that their little darling would grow to become a stellar athlete. Looking at my wife's and my athletic ability, we had no dreams of that and sent our daughter to kindergarten even with a late October birthday; socially and academically she was ready.

Lo and behold, as a freshman she was competing against girls 5 years older than she, and girls in her class are 18 months older. Her thoughts? She wouldn't change it--just makes her tougher. . . .

You may not see it, but you put her at an academic disadvantage by putting her in Kindergarten at 4 yo. Every academic paper on the subject shows it.

+1,000,000.  

I started school at the normal age, but was skipped a grade, completing third and fourth grade in the same year.  My father-in-law had the same miserable experience.  We both started our senior year in high school as 16 year olds.  The disparity in maturity and capability between boys who are a year apart is beyond significant.  And we both agreed that if there were one decision in our lives we could have back, it would be that one, for all the obvious reasons.

My oldest son was born September 10, and yes, the cutoff was September 1.  My wife, blissfully unaware of the disadvantages faced by the youngest male in any sociological group insisted that he start school a year early to avoid an admissions bubble at our favored grammar school. And he would have turned out "fine" in the way that "fine" is used and considered by any husband who says his wife's dress looks "fine."

I haven't won many battles with my lovely bride over the past 30+ years, but I won that one because I dug in like a tick.  And the kid turned out fantastic, believe you me, much better than he otherwise would have.