10-18-2023, 02:05 PM
The United States has killed many more civilians over the years than Israel has. The Afghanistan War and Iraq War are recent examples of conflicts where many thousands of civilians died, a significant portion of them in US strikes. In Iraq, the US struck electricity infrastructure, which caused hardship to civilians. That does not make recent US government officials guilty of war crimes. The mainstream media certainly does not portray the US as a rogue state that intentionally harms civilians. That's appropriate because international law does not say that a nation has acted unlawfully when civilians die as a result of defensive military operations. Yet the media treats Israel very different from how it treats the US.
You say that Israel has a history of targeting civilians and lying about it. The example you provided, however, is far from conclusive on that point. The US government agency that investigated the death of Shireen Abu Akleh concluded that there was "no reason to believe that this [the shooting] was intentional." https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/05/middleeas...index.html. CNN conducted a separate investigation, which CNN said suggested that the soldier intentionally shot the journalist. https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/24/middleeas...index.html. I am not sure that the intent of the Israeli soldier who fired the shot is knowable, but even assuming murderous intent (which the US government disputed), unless I'm missing something, I don't think there's strong evidence that the IDF lied about the incident. To the contrary, the CNN article above states that the IDF conducted an investigation, acknowledged it was likely that one of its soldiers shot the journalist, and told the media that the solider was sorry that it happened.
Nevertheless, I'm not saying that you should blindly trust the IDF or blindly accept that Israel has not targeted civilians. I'm saying that we should look at the specific facts on a case-by-case basis to reach our own judgment as to whether Israel's government and/or individual Israeli soldiers have acted illegally.
With all that said, I definitely understand your point about the IDF's statements to the press that it is not going to be so careful of civilians. I've previously speculated in this thread that the IDF made statements like that as a scare tactic to cause civilians to leave northern Gaza. If that was the purpose (which is unclear), then I can understand Israel's reasoning, but I still probably would conclude that the statements to the press were a PR blunder. The same is true for statements by the IDF that it would not allow humanitarian aid or even re-start running water in Gaza until all hostages were returned. But I note that Israel has now allowed some humanitarian aid and has resumed water in some areas despite the fact that no hostages have been released. I would argue that this is evidence that Israel's bluff has been called, but also that Israel never really intended for Gazan civilians to die from lack of water or food.
You say that Israel has a history of targeting civilians and lying about it. The example you provided, however, is far from conclusive on that point. The US government agency that investigated the death of Shireen Abu Akleh concluded that there was "no reason to believe that this [the shooting] was intentional." https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/05/middleeas...index.html. CNN conducted a separate investigation, which CNN said suggested that the soldier intentionally shot the journalist. https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/24/middleeas...index.html. I am not sure that the intent of the Israeli soldier who fired the shot is knowable, but even assuming murderous intent (which the US government disputed), unless I'm missing something, I don't think there's strong evidence that the IDF lied about the incident. To the contrary, the CNN article above states that the IDF conducted an investigation, acknowledged it was likely that one of its soldiers shot the journalist, and told the media that the solider was sorry that it happened.
Nevertheless, I'm not saying that you should blindly trust the IDF or blindly accept that Israel has not targeted civilians. I'm saying that we should look at the specific facts on a case-by-case basis to reach our own judgment as to whether Israel's government and/or individual Israeli soldiers have acted illegally.
With all that said, I definitely understand your point about the IDF's statements to the press that it is not going to be so careful of civilians. I've previously speculated in this thread that the IDF made statements like that as a scare tactic to cause civilians to leave northern Gaza. If that was the purpose (which is unclear), then I can understand Israel's reasoning, but I still probably would conclude that the statements to the press were a PR blunder. The same is true for statements by the IDF that it would not allow humanitarian aid or even re-start running water in Gaza until all hostages were returned. But I note that Israel has now allowed some humanitarian aid and has resumed water in some areas despite the fact that no hostages have been released. I would argue that this is evidence that Israel's bluff has been called, but also that Israel never really intended for Gazan civilians to die from lack of water or food.
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