[Phogge]

This was a very of immense proportions loss reminiscent of the 1999 Texas football beatdown. Ergo it was huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge.

[Phogge]

This was a very of immense proportions loss reminiscent of the 1999 Texas football beatdown. Ergo it was huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge.

[Sam Leopold]

The Zags lose to St. Maries!  Today the #1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and 9 ranked teams lost.  Seven of the top ten ranked teams lost.  This has never happened before.

Can't say I saw the Gonzaga loss coming.  That Zag offense was just crushing everything, and St. Mary's found a way to grind it down to scrap.  And they're having this banner season with a roster that is heavily Australian, as Randy Bennett has made a penchant of doing lately.

So the top 6 teams all lose, and Dook was #7 and rolled past Syracuse together with their win at Virginia earlier this week.  Does Duke become #1 next week?

[Sam Leopold]

The Zags lose to St. Maries!  Today the #1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and 9 ranked teams lost.  Seven of the top ten ranked teams lost.  This has never happened before.

Can't say I saw the Gonzaga loss coming.  That Zag offense was just crushing everything, and St. Mary's found a way to grind it down to scrap.  And they're having this banner season with a roster that is heavily Australian, as Randy Bennett has made a penchant of doing lately.

So the top 6 teams all lose, and Dook was #7 and rolled past Syracuse together with their win at Virginia earlier this week.  Does Duke become #1 next week?

[CompSci87]

The Zags lose to St. Maries!  Today the #1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and 9 ranked teams lost.  Seven of the top ten ranked teams lost.  This has never happened before.

So I guess it's opposite day and thus Stanford losing to Cal actually proves Stanford is better. No? Darn.

[CompSci87]

The Zags lose to St. Maries!  Today the #1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and 9 ranked teams lost.  Seven of the top ten ranked teams lost.  This has never happened before.

So I guess it's opposite day and thus Stanford losing to Cal actually proves Stanford is better. No? Darn.

[teejers1]

I still believe none of

 the head coaches will get fired during this year dominated by COVID protocols and COVID absenteeism, but Haase is doing his best to test my belief that all of the coaches will be safe.

Muir came in as some kind of basketball expert, if he doesn't think he can find someone that could do more with this roster than he also needs to go.

That noted, I didn't really think Stanford would beat this Cal team and I suspect Stanford men's hoops will not win another game this season.  That's the Haase season ending pattern and not much has happened in the 2021-2022 season that we haven't seem before.

Yep.  We may never find out which coach will do better next season in the major sports because one of them could very well be gone (and we know it ain't going to be Shaw).  The L was completely CLEARLY unsurprising (Lex, that was for you - clearly can be used at face value).
And btw, Beskind may have had best shooting % of the night (1 for 2 my son relayed . . . I didn't watch a second of the game, thankfully).

[teejers1]

I still believe none of

 the head coaches will get fired during this year dominated by COVID protocols and COVID absenteeism, but Haase is doing his best to test my belief that all of the coaches will be safe.

Muir came in as some kind of basketball expert, if he doesn't think he can find someone that could do more with this roster than he also needs to go.

That noted, I didn't really think Stanford would beat this Cal team and I suspect Stanford men's hoops will not win another game this season.  That's the Haase season ending pattern and not much has happened in the 2021-2022 season that we haven't seem before.

Yep.  We may never find out which coach will do better next season in the major sports because one of them could very well be gone (and we know it ain't going to be Shaw).  The L was completely CLEARLY unsurprising (Lex, that was for you - clearly can be used at face value).
And btw, Beskind may have had best shooting % of the night (1 for 2 my son relayed . . . I didn't watch a second of the game, thankfully).

[gailtate]

I gave up on Stanford hoops so long ago I can't remember, but I watched SM cold-cock the mighy Zags last night in game that brought back memories of great basketball played in an electric atmosphere. Really great to see again. I saw the Stanford score on the crawl. Mild disgust, then, back to watching good hoops. Looks like #MuirAndHaaseMustGo, too. HAHAHAHAHAH. Seriously, guys, following crap football AND hoops isn't good for you.

[gailtate]

I gave up on Stanford hoops so long ago I can't remember, but I watched SM cold-cock the mighy Zags last night in game that brought back memories of great basketball played in an electric atmosphere. Really great to see again. I saw the Stanford score on the crawl. Mild disgust, then, back to watching good hoops. Looks like #MuirAndHaaseMustGo, too. HAHAHAHAHAH. Seriously, guys, following crap football AND hoops isn't good for you.

[JohnR34231]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

[JohnR34231]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

[Oskidunker]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

Don’t be too hard on Hasse. He is a good  guy. 8700 people were at the game last night.  I think the crowd bothered Stanford. Not sure why so many showed but when no one has been going all year. Students sold out their allotment. There was-a Rapper there at half time so maybe that was the draw for them . Have not seen this large a crowd in 5 years. Maybe we meet again in the Pac 12 tournament although  it looks like we may get WSU the way the standings are now. Not sure why Keefe was so ineffective. He dominated Cal in Maples.

[Oskidunker]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

Don’t be too hard on Hasse. He is a good  guy. 8700 people were at the game last night.  I think the crowd bothered Stanford. Not sure why so many showed but when no one has been going all year. Students sold out their allotment. There was-a Rapper there at half time so maybe that was the draw for them . Have not seen this large a crowd in 5 years. Maybe we meet again in the Pac 12 tournament although  it looks like we may get WSU the way the standings are now. Not sure why Keefe was so ineffective. He dominated Cal in Maples.

[Goose]

Not sure why Keefe was so ineffective. He dominated Cal in Maples.

I am not sure why the entire team was so ineffective. Haase obviously can't form a team that gets better as the year goes on. The pattern is that they are average for the first half of the season and then fall apart in the second half of the year. That said, I can't help but believe that any random 5 guys could have played better than Stanford did against Cal. Getting beat soundly is one thing. Barely getting double digits in the first half is another. That is just really sick bad. Should not be possible. The players aren't individually that bad. Playing like that shows there is a real basic problem in the program. I don't know if it is the coach, the assistants, recruiting the wrong guys, or all of the above, but this performance was below pathetic IMHO.
If the AD was competent, there would at a minimum be a deep dive into why the pattern of no improvement repeats. Haase maybe can recruit. It has been said he has a good relationship with his players. However, if he does, that relationship isn't leading to results. That needs to change. Maybe it is Haase, but after this performance one wonders if there isn't more to it than just that.

[Goose]

Not sure why Keefe was so ineffective. He dominated Cal in Maples.

I am not sure why the entire team was so ineffective. Haase obviously can't form a team that gets better as the year goes on. The pattern is that they are average for the first half of the season and then fall apart in the second half of the year. That said, I can't help but believe that any random 5 guys could have played better than Stanford did against Cal. Getting beat soundly is one thing. Barely getting double digits in the first half is another. That is just really sick bad. Should not be possible. The players aren't individually that bad. Playing like that shows there is a real basic problem in the program. I don't know if it is the coach, the assistants, recruiting the wrong guys, or all of the above, but this performance was below pathetic IMHO.
If the AD was competent, there would at a minimum be a deep dive into why the pattern of no improvement repeats. Haase maybe can recruit. It has been said he has a good relationship with his players. However, if he does, that relationship isn't leading to results. That needs to change. Maybe it is Haase, but after this performance one wonders if there isn't more to it than just that.

[Hurlburt88]

Disgusting
disgusting that we repeatedly crash late in every season
disgusting that we have future pros whose contributions fade down the stretch
disgusting that decent individual talent can't be put together coherently 
disgusting that AD has not yet been replaced so someone can take positive action

[Hurlburt88]

Disgusting
disgusting that we repeatedly crash late in every season
disgusting that we have future pros whose contributions fade down the stretch
disgusting that decent individual talent can't be put together coherently 
disgusting that AD has not yet been replaced so someone can take positive action

[RuralFan]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

Don’t be too hard on Hasse. He is a good  guy. 

Hasse does seem like a good guy.  I just wish I knew why the wheels have come off the bus.  There was real hope for this team early in the season, and we had some nice wins, even in conference.  Now we just aren't competitive, even against the teams at the bottom of the conference. So exactly what went wrong?  The guys seems to be trying to compete, although there are moments of frustration. What should the coaches be doing that they aren't.  I just don't know.

[RuralFan]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

Don’t be too hard on Hasse. He is a good  guy. 

Hasse does seem like a good guy.  I just wish I knew why the wheels have come off the bus.  There was real hope for this team early in the season, and we had some nice wins, even in conference.  Now we just aren't competitive, even against the teams at the bottom of the conference. So exactly what went wrong?  The guys seems to be trying to compete, although there are moments of frustration. What should the coaches be doing that they aren't.  I just don't know.

[gailtate]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

Don’t be too hard on Hasse. He is a good  guy. 8700 people were at the game last night.  I think the crowd bothered Stanford. Not sure why so many showed but when no one has been going all year. Students sold out their allotment. There was-a Rapper there at half time so maybe that was the draw for them . Have not seen this large a crowd in 5 years. Maybe we meet again in the Pac 12 tournament although  it looks like we may get WSU the way the standings are now. Not sure why Keefe was so ineffective. He dominated Cal in Maples.

What does being "a good guy" have to do with ANYTHING in this context? There are a TON of "good guys" out there and many of them are coaching elite teams year after year. Every Stanford coach is "good guy". Being "a good guy" is a basic assumption (ergo, not specified in any job description). What Stanford needs today in hoops and football are coaches who can build and maintain A WINNING PROGRAM.  You know, the kind like in the past?

[gailtate]

The loss wasn't surprising, but a 35-12 halftime deficit to an 11-17 team definitely was.
I didn't realize we had become THAT bad,

Don’t be too hard on Hasse. He is a good  guy. 8700 people were at the game last night.  I think the crowd bothered Stanford. Not sure why so many showed but when no one has been going all year. Students sold out their allotment. There was-a Rapper there at half time so maybe that was the draw for them . Have not seen this large a crowd in 5 years. Maybe we meet again in the Pac 12 tournament although  it looks like we may get WSU the way the standings are now. Not sure why Keefe was so ineffective. He dominated Cal in Maples.

What does being "a good guy" have to do with ANYTHING in this context? There are a TON of "good guys" out there and many of them are coaching elite teams year after year. Every Stanford coach is "good guy". Being "a good guy" is a basic assumption (ergo, not specified in any job description). What Stanford needs today in hoops and football are coaches who can build and maintain A WINNING PROGRAM.  You know, the kind like in the past?

[Goose]

What Stanford needs today in hoops and football are coaches who can build and maintain A WINNING PROGRAM.   You know, the kind like in the past?

The kind like in the past mostly did not build and/or maintain "winning" programs, as has been pointed out time and time again by many others on this site. Mediocre or worse is historically far more common than "winning". That said, winning is the goal, and Haase hasn't met the goal in his time at Stanford. At this point, I think suggestions for a new coach are indeed relevant. The generic "anybody but who we have" really doesn't work for me, because mediocre or worse is the most probable outcome based on history.

[Goose]

What Stanford needs today in hoops and football are coaches who can build and maintain A WINNING PROGRAM.   You know, the kind like in the past?

The kind like in the past mostly did not build and/or maintain "winning" programs, as has been pointed out time and time again by many others on this site. Mediocre or worse is historically far more common than "winning". That said, winning is the goal, and Haase hasn't met the goal in his time at Stanford. At this point, I think suggestions for a new coach are indeed relevant. The generic "anybody but who we have" really doesn't work for me, because mediocre or worse is the most probable outcome based on history.

[gailtate]

What Stanford needs today in hoops and football are coaches who can build and maintain A WINNING PROGRAM.   You know, the kind like in the past?

The kind like in the past mostly did not build and/or maintain "winning" programs, as has been pointed out time and time again by many others on this site. Mediocre or worse is historically far more common than "winning". That said, winning is the goal, and Haase hasn't met the goal in his time at Stanford. At this point, I think suggestions for a new coach are indeed relevant. The generic "anybody but who we have" really doesn't work for me, because mediocre or worse is the most probable outcome based on history.

S

OK, as long as you're splitting hairs, I'll note that I failed the granularity test. I'm talking very recent past, obviously. (At least I assumed it was obvious.) I was specifically referencing the Mike Montgomery years at Maples, and the the Bowlsby/Harbaugh Axis of Football Reclamation and Rehabilitation. You know, the slip-stream that carried the present football coach to the heights he once enjoyed and his dwindlingfanboys continue to revere and celebrate. Those here who rightfully cite the generally undistinguished and, at best, the historically mediocre Stanford brands of football and basketball are dead-on correct, despite laughable trumpeting of "Home of Champions". Take away Tara, the country club sports and swimming pools, and the highest compliment you can extend to Stanford athletics is "respectable". Maybe. At least you could prior to Muir's arrival. Point is, the term "blue-blood brand' in FB and MBB has never described Stanford. And never will. Culture will tolerate it for a few years, then, poof. Like dandelion seeds.

[gailtate]

What Stanford needs today in hoops and football are coaches who can build and maintain A WINNING PROGRAM.   You know, the kind like in the past?

The kind like in the past mostly did not build and/or maintain "winning" programs, as has been pointed out time and time again by many others on this site. Mediocre or worse is historically far more common than "winning". That said, winning is the goal, and Haase hasn't met the goal in his time at Stanford. At this point, I think suggestions for a new coach are indeed relevant. The generic "anybody but who we have" really doesn't work for me, because mediocre or worse is the most probable outcome based on history.

S

OK, as long as you're splitting hairs, I'll note that I failed the granularity test. I'm talking very recent past, obviously. (At least I assumed it was obvious.) I was specifically referencing the Mike Montgomery years at Maples, and the the Bowlsby/Harbaugh Axis of Football Reclamation and Rehabilitation. You know, the slip-stream that carried the present football coach to the heights he once enjoyed and his dwindlingfanboys continue to revere and celebrate. Those here who rightfully cite the generally undistinguished and, at best, the historically mediocre Stanford brands of football and basketball are dead-on correct, despite laughable trumpeting of "Home of Champions". Take away Tara, the country club sports and swimming pools, and the highest compliment you can extend to Stanford athletics is "respectable". Maybe. At least you could prior to Muir's arrival. Point is, the term "blue-blood brand' in FB and MBB has never described Stanford. And never will. Culture will tolerate it for a few years, then, poof. Like dandelion seeds.

[Phogge]

I swear Bobbbbbb may need to up his meds if they can't win the Ted Cup. Horrible football followed by everybody give up basketball has me worried about him.

[Phogge]

I swear Bobbbbbb may need to up his meds if they can't win the Ted Cup. Horrible football followed by everybody give up basketball has me worried about him.

[Treebound]

It is time.  Every year Muir gives Haase another hall pass and we get the same poor results, especially at the end of the season.  Shaw made no changes to his poor program after another horrendous season - Shavita redux here we go again.   Now Haase has another season that looks like too many of his past episodes.  Good talent that is not developing and the team tanks down the stretch.  Poor in game decision making and execution. Injuries, covid, personalities...excuses.   The win loss record is the metric and he's not getting it done.   Bob Bowlsby would have made the call much earlier.    As TC mentioned, even the Sears Cup streak is now done.   Time for change on so many levels and I think MTL/Drell need to put the pressure on.

[Treebound]

It is time.  Every year Muir gives Haase another hall pass and we get the same poor results, especially at the end of the season.  Shaw made no changes to his poor program after another horrendous season - Shavita redux here we go again.   Now Haase has another season that looks like too many of his past episodes.  Good talent that is not developing and the team tanks down the stretch.  Poor in game decision making and execution. Injuries, covid, personalities...excuses.   The win loss record is the metric and he's not getting it done.   Bob Bowlsby would have made the call much earlier.    As TC mentioned, even the Sears Cup streak is now done.   Time for change on so many levels and I think MTL/Drell need to put the pressure on.

[BostonCard]

Mike Montgomery was three coaches ago.  Incoming freshmen may not have been born the last time he coached a Stanford game. Really hard to count something that happened almost 20 years ago as “recent history”.

BC

[BostonCard]

Mike Montgomery was three coaches ago.  Incoming freshmen may not have been born the last time he coached a Stanford game. Really hard to count something that happened almost 20 years ago as “recent history”.

BC

[teejers1]

Disgusting
disgusting that we repeatedly crash late in every season
disgusting that we have future pros whose contributions fade down the stretch
disgusting that decent individual talent can't be put together coherently 
disgusting that AD has not yet been replaced so someone can take positive action

If by "future pros" you mean future NBA players, I'm not seeing it.
Ingram does not have an NBA skill set or attributes.  At least not yet.  Maybe he an develop a dead-eye shot from distance, but he's not there yet.  Not close.  And the rest of his game is pedestrian (at best) by NBA standards.

[teejers1]

Disgusting
disgusting that we repeatedly crash late in every season
disgusting that we have future pros whose contributions fade down the stretch
disgusting that decent individual talent can't be put together coherently 
disgusting that AD has not yet been replaced so someone can take positive action

If by "future pros" you mean future NBA players, I'm not seeing it.
Ingram does not have an NBA skill set or attributes.  At least not yet.  Maybe he an develop a dead-eye shot from distance, but he's not there yet.  Not close.  And the rest of his game is pedestrian (at best) by NBA standards.

[pefloresjr]

Don't know how to embed a tweet, so here is the link to Ben Muth's tweet.
[tweet]https://twitter.com/FO_wordofmuth/status/1497826376065306626[/tweet]

Cheers,
Pete F.

[pefloresjr]

Don't know how to embed a tweet, so here is the link to Ben Muth's tweet.
[tweet]https://twitter.com/FO_wordofmuth/status/1497826376065306626[/tweet]

Cheers,
Pete F.

[BostonCard]

I embedded it for you, and Muth is dead on.  His concern about trajectory of the football team is well understood, but his ability to put it into perspective the difference between the two coaches is spot on.

BC

[BostonCard]

I embedded it for you, and Muth is dead on.  His concern about trajectory of the football team is well understood, but his ability to put it into perspective the difference between the two coaches is spot on.

BC

[teejers1]

I embedded it for you, and Muth is dead on.  His concern about trajectory of the football team is well understood, but his ability to put it into perspective the difference between the two coaches is spot on.

BC

If Shaw had built a program or taken over one that was mediocre and compiled the record he did, then you (and Muth) would have a much better point.  You continue to over-credit Shaw's record due to the program he was gifted.

Shaw is medium to mediocre; Haase is just mediocre.  (The late season fades are brutal - and the Cal L in hoops was eerily similar to football, out of the contest early against poor foe).

[teejers1]

I embedded it for you, and Muth is dead on.  His concern about trajectory of the football team is well understood, but his ability to put it into perspective the difference between the two coaches is spot on.

BC

If Shaw had built a program or taken over one that was mediocre and compiled the record he did, then you (and Muth) would have a much better point.  You continue to over-credit Shaw's record due to the program he was gifted.

Shaw is medium to mediocre; Haase is just mediocre.  (The late season fades are brutal - and the Cal L in hoops was eerily similar to football, out of the contest early against poor foe).