[cardfan1996]

Wow CardFan1996, you've taught me a great lesson.  Don't read game thread posts that are more than 12 hours old.

According to your logic, we should all just stop watching our 20-2 team play. 

Nah.  I'm with Johnny.  I'm going to cherish watching our team until the last game of the season, win or lose.  I can't even imagine being in a mindset where I thought I knew more than Tara in how to guide this team.

You must have been reading a different post. Because the one I read from CardFan1996, they never said we should stop watching the team. They were just pointing out that BosCard's assertion that this is essentially the same team that won the national title two years ago and made the Final Four is incorrect.

The graduations of Kiana Williams, Lexie & Lacie Hull and Anna Wilson have not been compensated by the additions of the incoming class, because the underclassmen either are playing different positions and/or do not have the same level or type of skill set of the departing players.

I come down in support of CardFan1996's points. While our underclassmen are talented and more importantly, they will contribute to Stanford and the community in many different and much more important ways than their role on the women's team, Tara and the coaching staff has not adapted as well this year to our strengths and weaknesses, IMO.

A side note and related to CardFan1996's point regarding our relative lack of success in recruiting top flight guards as compared to forwards and posts, I wonder whether our allusions to whether players have been instructed not to take midrange jumpers and Tara's general aversion to them, plays a role in turning off those elite guards whose midrange game is an important part of their arsenal from wanting to join our program. If you're an elite scoring guard used to scoring at all three levels, if you've heard that a coach actively dislikes a certain type of shot that you're used to, you might not be as enthuastic as joining the program (with all other things being equal).

Tara is a HoF coach and she has had unparalleled success in the game, but she is not infallible. She has strengths and weaknesses as every other coach. As fans, we can grumble and criticize in a fair and fact-based manner. Believe me, the criticism on this board is restrained and objective, compared to the kneejerk, emotional responses I've read elsewhere in response to coaching decisions: "Coach X is an idiot...Coach Y is a coward."

Stubbornness can be a good and a bad thing. From her statements in the postgame pressers and from what we've seen on the court, the changes we believe she should make will likely not be implemented. It is what it is. I, nor any of us can change her mind.

I still think we have the talent this year to challenge for the national title. What has changed for me is that I believe the variability has widened based on our recent results. I thought our floor was an Elite Eight or even Final Four with an unbeaten conference season, but given our offensive struggles, I won't be surprised if we dropped three or four more regular season games and be susceptible to a Sweet 16 upset loss (based on the matchup).

That change in expectation will help manage my emotions and frustration, but that doesn't make me less of a fan or make me believe we should stop watching the team. 

To 81alum's post on changing offensive schemes, I don't follow other programs closely enough, but is this a common theme with other coaches, to change the strategy - Princeton, triangle, flow, etc. multiple times within a few years? Obviously, coaching staffs should tweak things based on the strengths and weaknesses of their current roster, but it seems like changing the general strategy so greatly is causing more consternation than it should?

Yep I was responding to that specific point re: the rosters being the same. They couldn’t be more different. Haley was MVP of the final four because she had the luxury of going 1 on 1, and no one being in her driving lanes digging at the ball. Cam could go 1 on 1 in the post. I don’t remember either seeing much in the way of double teams that championship run because you simply could not afford to leave either Kianna or Lexie open for 3. Add to that, Haley’s 3-ball mysteriously starts going in at a high rate in the tourney and Anna shooting close to 100% from 3 when they left her open, it’s a wonder Stanford didn’t beat that lightly talented Arizona team by double digits. With the right personnel, they still only won by one pt in the semi-final and final.

So yes, it is incredibly hard to win even with the right personnel but with a flawed roster it is even more so. BUT every team has a flawed roster. The difference is other teams are finding ways to maximize what they have. We are not. Again I ask even the acolytes, will that starting lineup get very far in the tourney? Lepolo, Agnes, Haley, Cam and Hannah. Even we all can say confidently it will not because it doesn’t pass the eye test, then the staff must know too, or have a boulder sized blind spot. I think the latter because Tara is recycling bad ideas like she didn’t try all of these lineups in November. Why is that? Who knows. Tara had it in her head in the summer that making Haley a point guard 90% was going to work even though literally ALL the evidence said Haley would get tired, turn over the ball a lot and with more responsibility, be a less efficient scorer. Same thing happened to Anna and Lacie last year. Playing out of position also made them less efficient at the things they were actually good at in the run in 2021. My frustration is simply making the same mistakes and expecting different results. I’d be happy if new mistakes were being made in an effort to actually put a credible starting lineup on the floor that can compete for a championship.

Teams have been negatively recruiting against Tara and Stanford at the guard spot since Jackie Gemelos. The game is the game but Stanford hasn’t really done much IMO to counter whatever may be out there. 

I also do not think Tara has any issue with midrange shots especially since those are the only outside shots that Haley can make. I’m sure she’d be delighted if Cam developed a reliable midrange shot. And as an aside, I am personally perplexed since Cam is basically family with the best shooter in the history of the NBA and his dad and brother are at least Top 20 and Top 100 shooters, respectively. And his dad (her godfather) got her interested in the sport.

[cardfan1996]

Wow CardFan1996, you've taught me a great lesson.  Don't read game thread posts that are more than 12 hours old.

According to your logic, we should all just stop watching our 20-2 team play. 

Nah.  I'm with Johnny.  I'm going to cherish watching our team until the last game of the season, win or lose.  I can't even imagine being in a mindset where I thought I knew more than Tara in how to guide this team.

You must have been reading a different post. Because the one I read from CardFan1996, they never said we should stop watching the team. They were just pointing out that BosCard's assertion that this is essentially the same team that won the national title two years ago and made the Final Four is incorrect.

The graduations of Kiana Williams, Lexie & Lacie Hull and Anna Wilson have not been compensated by the additions of the incoming class, because the underclassmen either are playing different positions and/or do not have the same level or type of skill set of the departing players.

I come down in support of CardFan1996's points. While our underclassmen are talented and more importantly, they will contribute to Stanford and the community in many different and much more important ways than their role on the women's team, Tara and the coaching staff has not adapted as well this year to our strengths and weaknesses, IMO.

A side note and related to CardFan1996's point regarding our relative lack of success in recruiting top flight guards as compared to forwards and posts, I wonder whether our allusions to whether players have been instructed not to take midrange jumpers and Tara's general aversion to them, plays a role in turning off those elite guards whose midrange game is an important part of their arsenal from wanting to join our program. If you're an elite scoring guard used to scoring at all three levels, if you've heard that a coach actively dislikes a certain type of shot that you're used to, you might not be as enthuastic as joining the program (with all other things being equal).

Tara is a HoF coach and she has had unparalleled success in the game, but she is not infallible. She has strengths and weaknesses as every other coach. As fans, we can grumble and criticize in a fair and fact-based manner. Believe me, the criticism on this board is restrained and objective, compared to the kneejerk, emotional responses I've read elsewhere in response to coaching decisions: "Coach X is an idiot...Coach Y is a coward."

Stubbornness can be a good and a bad thing. From her statements in the postgame pressers and from what we've seen on the court, the changes we believe she should make will likely not be implemented. It is what it is. I, nor any of us can change her mind.

I still think we have the talent this year to challenge for the national title. What has changed for me is that I believe the variability has widened based on our recent results. I thought our floor was an Elite Eight or even Final Four with an unbeaten conference season, but given our offensive struggles, I won't be surprised if we dropped three or four more regular season games and be susceptible to a Sweet 16 upset loss (based on the matchup).

That change in expectation will help manage my emotions and frustration, but that doesn't make me less of a fan or make me believe we should stop watching the team. 

To 81alum's post on changing offensive schemes, I don't follow other programs closely enough, but is this a common theme with other coaches, to change the strategy - Princeton, triangle, flow, etc. multiple times within a few years? Obviously, coaching staffs should tweak things based on the strengths and weaknesses of their current roster, but it seems like changing the general strategy so greatly is causing more consternation than it should?

Yep I was responding to that specific point re: the rosters being the same. They couldn’t be more different. Haley was MVP of the final four because she had the luxury of going 1 on 1, and no one being in her driving lanes digging at the ball. Cam could go 1 on 1 in the post. I don’t remember either seeing much in the way of double teams that championship run because you simply could not afford to leave either Kianna or Lexie open for 3. Add to that, Haley’s 3-ball mysteriously starts going in at a high rate in the tourney and Anna shooting close to 100% from 3 when they left her open, it’s a wonder Stanford didn’t beat that lightly talented Arizona team by double digits. With the right personnel, they still only won by one pt in the semi-final and final.

So yes, it is incredibly hard to win even with the right personnel but with a flawed roster it is even more so. BUT every team has a flawed roster. The difference is other teams are finding ways to maximize what they have. We are not. Again I ask even the acolytes, will that starting lineup get very far in the tourney? Lepolo, Agnes, Haley, Cam and Hannah. Even we all can say confidently it will not because it doesn’t pass the eye test, then the staff must know too, or have a boulder sized blind spot. I think the latter because Tara is recycling bad ideas like she didn’t try all of these lineups in November. Why is that? Who knows. Tara had it in her head in the summer that making Haley a point guard 90% was going to work even though literally ALL the evidence said Haley would get tired, turn over the ball a lot and with more responsibility, be a less efficient scorer. Same thing happened to Anna and Lacie last year. Playing out of position also made them less efficient at the things they were actually good at in the run in 2021. My frustration is simply making the same mistakes and expecting different results. I’d be happy if new mistakes were being made in an effort to actually put a credible starting lineup on the floor that can compete for a championship.

Teams have been negatively recruiting against Tara and Stanford at the guard spot since Jackie Gemelos. The game is the game but Stanford hasn’t really done much IMO to counter whatever may be out there. 

I also do not think Tara has any issue with midrange shots especially since those are the only outside shots that Haley can make. I’m sure she’d be delighted if Cam developed a reliable midrange shot. And as an aside, I am personally perplexed since Cam is basically family with the best shooter in the history of the NBA and his dad and brother are at least Top 20 and Top 100 shooters, respectively. And his dad (her godfather) got her interested in the sport.