[DC 86]

Fact is, Harbaugh's shelf life is 3-4 years. After that, his shtick loses any sort of appeal to fans.

I don't agree. His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

San Diego: nobody there clamoring for his dismissal although they were resigned to the fact that it was inevitable.

Stanford: in retrospect the change to Shaw worked out perfectly, but nobody was clamoring for his dismissal, in fact there were widespread concerns that post-Harbaugh the program might not be able to sustain success. As it turns out it was perfect timing and the perfect successor who took the program to even greater heights, but Harbaugh wasn't pushed out or fighting any wave of fan antagonism.

49ers: forced out by Baalke and York but still had widespread fan support. Most fans were concerned about Harbaugh leaving (and would have preferred Baalke to leave if it came to that), which proved to be a valid concern.

Harbaugh certainly wears thin on his superiors and irritates his players, and his act eventually annoys fans, but fans ultimately mostly care about winning, and in all three previous jobs Harbaugh's dismissal/resignation was met by concern or disappointment by fans.

Harbaugh's fan support at Michigan is directly correlated to how much he wins next season.

Having said all that, I think it's in his nature to seek new opportunities instead of settling in somewhere, so a return to the NFL at some point is more likely than a long stay at Michigan, regardless of his results there.

[DC 86]

Fact is, Harbaugh's shelf life is 3-4 years. After that, his shtick loses any sort of appeal to fans.

I don't agree. His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

San Diego: nobody there clamoring for his dismissal although they were resigned to the fact that it was inevitable.

Stanford: in retrospect the change to Shaw worked out perfectly, but nobody was clamoring for his dismissal, in fact there were widespread concerns that post-Harbaugh the program might not be able to sustain success. As it turns out it was perfect timing and the perfect successor who took the program to even greater heights, but Harbaugh wasn't pushed out or fighting any wave of fan antagonism.

49ers: forced out by Baalke and York but still had widespread fan support. Most fans were concerned about Harbaugh leaving (and would have preferred Baalke to leave if it came to that), which proved to be a valid concern.

Harbaugh certainly wears thin on his superiors and irritates his players, and his act eventually annoys fans, but fans ultimately mostly care about winning, and in all three previous jobs Harbaugh's dismissal/resignation was met by concern or disappointment by fans.

Harbaugh's fan support at Michigan is directly correlated to how much he wins next season.

Having said all that, I think it's in his nature to seek new opportunities instead of settling in somewhere, so a return to the NFL at some point is more likely than a long stay at Michigan, regardless of his results there.

[jacketree]

College football is getting close to shark jumping with the carousel this year.  As to the Pirate, as long as they have weddings and YouTube where he lands, I'm OK with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGIap2_tmng

[jacketree]

College football is getting close to shark jumping with the carousel this year.  As to the Pirate, as long as they have weddings and YouTube where he lands, I'm OK with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGIap2_tmng

[CornFed]

My girlfriend's daughter is getting married in a couple of weeks and I just showed her that Leach video that oman posted earlier.  She laughed so hard that her knees almost buckled.  Then, when she had finally gotten control of herself she said, "But WE'RE not like that."

I laughed until my knees almost buckled.

[CornFed]

My girlfriend's daughter is getting married in a couple of weeks and I just showed her that Leach video that oman posted earlier.  She laughed so hard that her knees almost buckled.  Then, when she had finally gotten control of herself she said, "But WE'RE not like that."

I laughed until my knees almost buckled.

[washingtonismoney]

Michael Eubanks posted on twitter that the increased upheaval this year is likely a consequence of the new signing period, and said it was time to end the experiment. Of course Stanford is *very* self-interested there, but I think he has a point. This was a foreseeable consequence, but the results don't seem great for the coaches or the kids.

(The coaches are the ones who have to feel most embarrassed here. They were the ones selling the early signing period, probably -- again -- out of self-interest. Doesn't seem to be working out, hm?)

[washingtonismoney]

Michael Eubanks posted on twitter that the increased upheaval this year is likely a consequence of the new signing period, and said it was time to end the experiment. Of course Stanford is *very* self-interested there, but I think he has a point. This was a foreseeable consequence, but the results don't seem great for the coaches or the kids.

(The coaches are the ones who have to feel most embarrassed here. They were the ones selling the early signing period, probably -- again -- out of self-interest. Doesn't seem to be working out, hm?)

[jacketree]

Hey WIM,  what's the rationale behind that?  Are you (or I guess Eubanks) talking about the timing of the upheaval, or the sheer number of coaches playing musical chairs?  I can see the former linkage, but no so much the latter.

[jacketree]

Hey WIM,  what's the rationale behind that?  Are you (or I guess Eubanks) talking about the timing of the upheaval, or the sheer number of coaches playing musical chairs?  I can see the former linkage, but no so much the latter.

[washingtonismoney]

Hey WIM,  what's the rationale behind that?  Are you (or I guess Eubanks) talking about the timing of the upheaval, or the sheer number of coaches playing musical chairs?  I can see the former linkage, but no so much the latter.

I'm saying the timing of the upheaval is definitely related, and indirectly the latter. i.e. more time for hiring and firing means more hires and fires. My thinking is that previously, coaches could save their jobs from midseason ruts by going on a miracle run. Les Miles did it a few times. But now, because ADs have to think of the health of the signing class in December, they might be inclined to make the fire *early.* So (theoretically) you might've seen a guy like McElwain or Jones given the second half of the year to make his case. Now it's all "pull the trigger" because otherwise the recruiting class will tank.

And I suppose there's an outside chance of an NFL head coaching job going to a college guy.

[washingtonismoney]

Hey WIM,  what's the rationale behind that?  Are you (or I guess Eubanks) talking about the timing of the upheaval, or the sheer number of coaches playing musical chairs?  I can see the former linkage, but no so much the latter.

I'm saying the timing of the upheaval is definitely related, and indirectly the latter. i.e. more time for hiring and firing means more hires and fires. My thinking is that previously, coaches could save their jobs from midseason ruts by going on a miracle run. Les Miles did it a few times. But now, because ADs have to think of the health of the signing class in December, they might be inclined to make the fire *early.* So (theoretically) you might've seen a guy like McElwain or Jones given the second half of the year to make his case. Now it's all "pull the trigger" because otherwise the recruiting class will tank.

And I suppose there's an outside chance of an NFL head coaching job going to a college guy.

[82lsju]

So apparently Tennessee's AD reached a deal with Leach...only to be fired this morning: https://www.si.com/college-football/2017...twitter_si

Phil Fulmer to be new TN AD

http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...c-director

[82lsju]

So apparently Tennessee's AD reached a deal with Leach...only to be fired this morning: https://www.si.com/college-football/2017...twitter_si

Phil Fulmer to be new TN AD

http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...c-director

[CowboyIndian]

His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.

[CowboyIndian]

His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.

[stupac2]

[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=18232.msg216028#msg216028 date=1512158552]
His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.
[/quote]

Maybe it's just because I was paying somewhat less attention to this sort of thing in 2010, but I don't remember hearing about this at all, despite how often it gets brought up here now. Is there more to it than "He didn't get along with Baldwin and Sherman"?

[stupac2]

[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=18232.msg216028#msg216028 date=1512158552]
His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.
[/quote]

Maybe it's just because I was paying somewhat less attention to this sort of thing in 2010, but I don't remember hearing about this at all, despite how often it gets brought up here now. Is there more to it than "He didn't get along with Baldwin and Sherman"?

[DC 86]

[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=18232.msg216028#msg216028 date=1512158552]
His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.
[/quote]

Yes I cited those issues in my post, but the argument was that fans turn against him in 3-4 years which I don't buy. They may turn against him if he doesn't win enough (or beat the main rivals) but not because his quirks become too much. I would add that fans can also hire/fire as seen last week at Tennessee, when the mob crosses a certain threshold the administrators are forced to react.

[DC 86]

[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=18232.msg216028#msg216028 date=1512158552]
His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.
[/quote]

Yes I cited those issues in my post, but the argument was that fans turn against him in 3-4 years which I don't buy. They may turn against him if he doesn't win enough (or beat the main rivals) but not because his quirks become too much. I would add that fans can also hire/fire as seen last week at Tennessee, when the mob crosses a certain threshold the administrators are forced to react.

[cardcrimson]

[quote author=washingtonismoney link=topic=18232.msg215986#msg215986 date=1512148727]
[quote author=CompSci87 link=topic=18232.msg215984#msg215984 date=1512147384]
The idea of an AD eventually getting fired for hiring the wrong coach is familiar, but this case takes it up to warp speed.

Well, or the right coach. Leach is an odd bird but seems like a perfectly solid hire given Tennessee's place on the pecking order.
[/quote]

Rumor has it he went rogue and circumvented the boosters (or really the main one, Jimmy Haslam - owner of the Browns) to try to get this done.
[/quote]

Can't see why the AD would do that, Haslam is a great judge of talent.

[cardcrimson]

[quote author=washingtonismoney link=topic=18232.msg215986#msg215986 date=1512148727]
[quote author=CompSci87 link=topic=18232.msg215984#msg215984 date=1512147384]
The idea of an AD eventually getting fired for hiring the wrong coach is familiar, but this case takes it up to warp speed.

Well, or the right coach. Leach is an odd bird but seems like a perfectly solid hire given Tennessee's place on the pecking order.
[/quote]

Rumor has it he went rogue and circumvented the boosters (or really the main one, Jimmy Haslam - owner of the Browns) to try to get this done.
[/quote]

Can't see why the AD would do that, Haslam is a great judge of talent.

[Mick]

[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=18232.msg216028#msg216028 date=1512158552]
His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.
[/quote]

According to this story, Harbaugh ordered Jed York out of a meeting because it was "for men only."

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/report-jim-harbaugh-told-ceo-jed-york-that-meeting-was-for-men-only-060815

Not a good way to stay employed...

[Mick]

[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=18232.msg216028#msg216028 date=1512158552]
His shtick does wear thin, but none of his career moves to date have been the result of fans turning against him.

No...but his act did wear thin with admins and owners...you know, the people who hire and fire. Plus...tolerance also seemed to be threadbare with a segment of the Stanford roster.
[/quote]

According to this story, Harbaugh ordered Jed York out of a meeting because it was "for men only."

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/report-jim-harbaugh-told-ceo-jed-york-that-meeting-was-for-men-only-060815

Not a good way to stay employed...

[CTcard]

By the way, in proof you can come home again, I've seen some twitter chatter about none other than Lane Kiffin going back to Tennessee.  I think that's dumb (about as likely as Tyrone Willingham being rehired as Stanford head coach), but still, I thought "man, those folks must be desperate"

Its more than twitter chatter, its all over the sports talk radio.

My (relatively) new car gets Sirius radio, which I have not had before, so I have started listening to what is now ESPNU radio. Lots of Tennessee fans call in, and those calling are just about unanimously pining for Kiffin.

[CTcard]

By the way, in proof you can come home again, I've seen some twitter chatter about none other than Lane Kiffin going back to Tennessee.  I think that's dumb (about as likely as Tyrone Willingham being rehired as Stanford head coach), but still, I thought "man, those folks must be desperate"

Its more than twitter chatter, its all over the sports talk radio.

My (relatively) new car gets Sirius radio, which I have not had before, so I have started listening to what is now ESPNU radio. Lots of Tennessee fans call in, and those calling are just about unanimously pining for Kiffin.

[DC 86]

[quote author=Boston Card link=topic=18232.msg216022#msg216022 date=1512157319]
By the way, in proof you can come home again, I've seen some twitter chatter about none other than Lane Kiffin going back to Tennessee.  I think that's dumb (about as likely as Tyrone Willingham being rehired as Stanford head coach), but still, I thought "man, those folks must be desperate"

Its more than twitter chatter, its all over the sports talk radio.

My (relatively) new car gets Sirius radio, which I have not had before, so I have started listening to what is now ESPNU radio. Lots of Tennessee fans can in, and those calling are just about unanimously pining for Kiffin.
[/quote]

Paul Fineman (who is the king of SEC media as well as a Tennessee native and UT alum) is leading the charge for Kiffin, which is not insignificant. He is tight with Fulmer (who was just named AD) and the administration there, so the fact that he is beating the drum for Kiffin (went on ESPN this morning calling Kiffin the best option) could be a trial balloon being floated to gauge how the Vol masses react. Inconceivable a few years ago after Kiffin departed abruptly.

[DC 86]

[quote author=Boston Card link=topic=18232.msg216022#msg216022 date=1512157319]
By the way, in proof you can come home again, I've seen some twitter chatter about none other than Lane Kiffin going back to Tennessee.  I think that's dumb (about as likely as Tyrone Willingham being rehired as Stanford head coach), but still, I thought "man, those folks must be desperate"

Its more than twitter chatter, its all over the sports talk radio.

My (relatively) new car gets Sirius radio, which I have not had before, so I have started listening to what is now ESPNU radio. Lots of Tennessee fans can in, and those calling are just about unanimously pining for Kiffin.
[/quote]

Paul Fineman (who is the king of SEC media as well as a Tennessee native and UT alum) is leading the charge for Kiffin, which is not insignificant. He is tight with Fulmer (who was just named AD) and the administration there, so the fact that he is beating the drum for Kiffin (went on ESPN this morning calling Kiffin the best option) could be a trial balloon being floated to gauge how the Vol masses react. Inconceivable a few years ago after Kiffin departed abruptly.

[cardcrimson]

[quote author=CTcard link=topic=18232.msg216073#msg216073 date=1512168703]
[quote author=Boston Card link=topic=18232.msg216022#msg216022 date=1512157319]
By the way, in proof you can come home again, I've seen some twitter chatter about none other than Lane Kiffin going back to Tennessee.  I think that's dumb (about as likely as Tyrone Willingham being rehired as Stanford head coach), but still, I thought "man, those folks must be desperate"

Its more than twitter chatter, its all over the sports talk radio.

My (relatively) new car gets Sirius radio, which I have not had before, so I have started listening to what is now ESPNU radio. Lots of Tennessee fans can in, and those calling are just about unanimously pining for Kiffin.
[/quote]

Paul Fineman (who is the king of SEC media as well as a Tennessee native and UT alum) is leading the charge for Kiffin, which is not insignificant. He is tight with Fulmer (who was just named AD) and the administration there, so the fact that he is beating the drum for Kiffin (went on ESPN this morning calling Kiffin the best option) could be a trial balloon being floated to gauge how the Vol masses react. Inconceivable a few years ago after Kiffin departed abruptly.
[/quote]

I think you mean Paul Finebaum. And if he's indeed leading the charge for Kiffen, it's not for Tennessee's sake, it's for his show's sake. Kiffen is a lightning rod, with the controversies of his original stint in Tennessee and the last stint at Alabama. Will make for absolutely great call in radio. . . .

[cardcrimson]

[quote author=CTcard link=topic=18232.msg216073#msg216073 date=1512168703]
[quote author=Boston Card link=topic=18232.msg216022#msg216022 date=1512157319]
By the way, in proof you can come home again, I've seen some twitter chatter about none other than Lane Kiffin going back to Tennessee.  I think that's dumb (about as likely as Tyrone Willingham being rehired as Stanford head coach), but still, I thought "man, those folks must be desperate"

Its more than twitter chatter, its all over the sports talk radio.

My (relatively) new car gets Sirius radio, which I have not had before, so I have started listening to what is now ESPNU radio. Lots of Tennessee fans can in, and those calling are just about unanimously pining for Kiffin.
[/quote]

Paul Fineman (who is the king of SEC media as well as a Tennessee native and UT alum) is leading the charge for Kiffin, which is not insignificant. He is tight with Fulmer (who was just named AD) and the administration there, so the fact that he is beating the drum for Kiffin (went on ESPN this morning calling Kiffin the best option) could be a trial balloon being floated to gauge how the Vol masses react. Inconceivable a few years ago after Kiffin departed abruptly.
[/quote]

I think you mean Paul Finebaum. And if he's indeed leading the charge for Kiffen, it's not for Tennessee's sake, it's for his show's sake. Kiffen is a lightning rod, with the controversies of his original stint in Tennessee and the last stint at Alabama. Will make for absolutely great call in radio. . . .

[DC 86]

I think you mean Paul Finebaum.

Yes, thanks. (autocorrect)

[DC 86]

I think you mean Paul Finebaum.

Yes, thanks. (autocorrect)

[magnus]

Looks like Alabama DC Jeremy Pruitt will be the next Tennessee HC

[magnus]

Looks like Alabama DC Jeremy Pruitt will be the next Tennessee HC

[CTcard]

John Canzano, The Oregonian's Jon Wilner, seems to believe that Kevin Sumlin is the odds-on favourite to be the duckies next coach.
Rank-two prospects include Leach, Wilcox, and Tedford.

I don't know anything about the quality of Canzano's contacts within the Oregon AD.

http://www.oregonlive.com/sports/oregoni...ncart_2box

[CTcard]

John Canzano, The Oregonian's Jon Wilner, seems to believe that Kevin Sumlin is the odds-on favourite to be the duckies next coach.
Rank-two prospects include Leach, Wilcox, and Tedford.

I don't know anything about the quality of Canzano's contacts within the Oregon AD.

http://www.oregonlive.com/sports/oregoni...ncart_2box

[washingtonismoney]

"Sumlin is an upgrade as a coach over Taggart" reads to me as the typical happy talk every fan tells him/herself before a coach actually gets hired.

[washingtonismoney]

"Sumlin is an upgrade as a coach over Taggart" reads to me as the typical happy talk every fan tells him/herself before a coach actually gets hired.

[French Rage]

Just to check I'm not missing something here:

Sumlin is rumored as a candidate for UO.  UO has a vacancy because Taggart went to FSU.  FSU had a vacancy because Fisher went to A&M.  A&M had a vacancy because Sumlin was fired.  The same Sumlin.

So basically everyone took a step to the left and ended up at different schools?

[French Rage]

Just to check I'm not missing something here:

Sumlin is rumored as a candidate for UO.  UO has a vacancy because Taggart went to FSU.  FSU had a vacancy because Fisher went to A&M.  A&M had a vacancy because Sumlin was fired.  The same Sumlin.

So basically everyone took a step to the left and ended up at different schools?