[M T]

It's not only American football, but also soccer (and rugby).
BBC: Legal action over brain injuries allegedly from football reaches High Court

I believe the defendants(?) are all pro soccer leagues.  I can see that a pro may make an informed decision to accept the risks.

It is harder for me to see college student-athletes doing so.  It is impossible for me to imagine that high-school students could.

If some court somewhere in the US awarded, say, $100M to some FB player for head injuries, I wonder how fast (or slow) the whole FB media-universe would disintegrate.

[M T]

It's not only American football, but also soccer (and rugby).
BBC: Legal action over brain injuries allegedly from football reaches High Court

I believe the defendants(?) are all pro soccer leagues.  I can see that a pro may make an informed decision to accept the risks.

It is harder for me to see college student-athletes doing so.  It is impossible for me to imagine that high-school students could.

If some court somewhere in the US awarded, say, $100M to some FB player for head injuries, I wonder how fast (or slow) the whole FB media-universe would disintegrate.

[TrumpCard]

It's not only American football, but also soccer (and rugby).
BBC: Legal action over brain injuries allegedly from football reaches High Court

I believe the defendants(?) are all pro soccer leagues.  I can see that a pro may make an informed decision to accept the risks.

It is harder for me to see college student-athletes doing so.  It is impossible for me to imagine that high-school students could.

If some court somewhere in the US awarded, say, $100M to some FB player for head injuries, I wonder how fast (or slow) the whole FB media-universe would disintegrate.

I suffered a lot of cognitive dissonance surrounding my enjoyment of a sport that demonstrably causes the participants to suffer brain damage, until I just stopped watching a few years ago.  I still follow Stanford's team cursorily here because I can't fully shake it, but I can't enjoy watching the sport the way I once could.  Nevertheless, I don't think other folks see it my way.  People still participate in MMA and boxing and millions of people line up to watch.  Given that background, I am not sure that folks are going to stop participating in, or watching, soccer or football, where there isn't an explicit goal of bashing the other person's head.

[TrumpCard]

It's not only American football, but also soccer (and rugby).
BBC: Legal action over brain injuries allegedly from football reaches High Court

I believe the defendants(?) are all pro soccer leagues.  I can see that a pro may make an informed decision to accept the risks.

It is harder for me to see college student-athletes doing so.  It is impossible for me to imagine that high-school students could.

If some court somewhere in the US awarded, say, $100M to some FB player for head injuries, I wonder how fast (or slow) the whole FB media-universe would disintegrate.

I suffered a lot of cognitive dissonance surrounding my enjoyment of a sport that demonstrably causes the participants to suffer brain damage, until I just stopped watching a few years ago.  I still follow Stanford's team cursorily here because I can't fully shake it, but I can't enjoy watching the sport the way I once could.  Nevertheless, I don't think other folks see it my way.  People still participate in MMA and boxing and millions of people line up to watch.  Given that background, I am not sure that folks are going to stop participating in, or watching, soccer or football, where there isn't an explicit goal of bashing the other person's head.

[dabigv13]

There aren't college and high school sponsored MMA fighters though.

That being said, courts in the US don't seem to be very friendly to plaintiffs trying to sue. Several lawsuits from people who died young, whether from suicide or some sort of accident, that autopsy showed CTE and played football have been dismissed given difficulty associating the football history with the CTE, and the CTE with whatever killed them.

The NCAA settled a CTE case in 2018 that went to trial, though the more recent cases I have seen the NCAA has won.

https://www.reuters.com/legal/ncaa-not-l...022-11-23/

On that same case
https://theathletic.com/3669382/2022/10/...wsuit-usc/

This was eyebrow raising....

In fact, the NCAA alleged in seeking to block the BU CTE report from entering evidence, that the brain bank took out references to cocaine use at the Gee’s family request.

“Finally, the Court should be aware that BU modified its own report at Plaintiff’s request before issuing a final report by removing its finding that the brain infarcts may have been related to Gee’s known cocaine use,” the NCAA charged. Infarcts are dead tissue.

BU did not reply to comment.

BU is pretty much where most of the CTE research has taken place.

A difficult thing to study but I don't think the science is solid enough for plaintiffs to win these cases.

[dabigv13]

There aren't college and high school sponsored MMA fighters though.

That being said, courts in the US don't seem to be very friendly to plaintiffs trying to sue. Several lawsuits from people who died young, whether from suicide or some sort of accident, that autopsy showed CTE and played football have been dismissed given difficulty associating the football history with the CTE, and the CTE with whatever killed them.

The NCAA settled a CTE case in 2018 that went to trial, though the more recent cases I have seen the NCAA has won.

https://www.reuters.com/legal/ncaa-not-l...022-11-23/

On that same case
https://theathletic.com/3669382/2022/10/...wsuit-usc/

This was eyebrow raising....

In fact, the NCAA alleged in seeking to block the BU CTE report from entering evidence, that the brain bank took out references to cocaine use at the Gee’s family request.

“Finally, the Court should be aware that BU modified its own report at Plaintiff’s request before issuing a final report by removing its finding that the brain infarcts may have been related to Gee’s known cocaine use,” the NCAA charged. Infarcts are dead tissue.

BU did not reply to comment.

BU is pretty much where most of the CTE research has taken place.

A difficult thing to study but I don't think the science is solid enough for plaintiffs to win these cases.

[M T]

BTW, apparently the lawsuit (linked above) about CTE from soccer is still ongoing as of April 2026.

In the news today is the CTE diagnosis of 2nd year NFL player who committed suicide 2 years ago at age 24.  I can't see how anyone could claim he suffered this only as an adult.  

I think that in time, football will go the way of the GM Corvair.
The complicity of paying big dollars to get minors to engage in risky behavior will likewise someday be a liability for schools.

[M T]

BTW, apparently the lawsuit (linked above) about CTE from soccer is still ongoing as of April 2026.

In the news today is the CTE diagnosis of 2nd year NFL player who committed suicide 2 years ago at age 24.  I can't see how anyone could claim he suffered this only as an adult.  

I think that in time, football will go the way of the GM Corvair.
The complicity of paying big dollars to get minors to engage in risky behavior will likewise someday be a liability for schools.

[fullmetal]

Related: Chris Johnson announced his ALS diagnosis recently, and ALS is one of the football trauma-related conditions included in the NFL's "88 Plan," which does not require a player to prove that football caused their condition (dementia and Parkinson's are two other notable, covered conditions).

https://www.nfl.com/videos/former-nfl-rb...the-minute
https://www.neworleanssaints.com/news/nf...ls-2931374

[fullmetal]

Related: Chris Johnson announced his ALS diagnosis recently, and ALS is one of the football trauma-related conditions included in the NFL's "88 Plan," which does not require a player to prove that football caused their condition (dementia and Parkinson's are two other notable, covered conditions).

https://www.nfl.com/videos/former-nfl-rb...the-minute
https://www.neworleanssaints.com/news/nf...ls-2931374

[M T]

Related: Chris Johnson announced his ALS diagnosis recently, and ALS is one of the football trauma-related conditions included in the NFL's "88 Plan," which does not require a player to prove that football caused their condition (dementia and Parkinson's are two other notable, covered conditions).

https://www.nfl.com/videos/former-nfl-rb...the-minute
https://www.neworleanssaints.com/news/nf...ls-2931374

I had someone important to me die of ALS.  It is a troubling disease.  The feeling of helplessness is overpowering.

If you're interested in the relation of brain injury to ALS, these two articles (1  and  2) may be of interest.  I haven't studied or researched the relation beyond that.

[M T]

Related: Chris Johnson announced his ALS diagnosis recently, and ALS is one of the football trauma-related conditions included in the NFL's "88 Plan," which does not require a player to prove that football caused their condition (dementia and Parkinson's are two other notable, covered conditions).

https://www.nfl.com/videos/former-nfl-rb...the-minute
https://www.neworleanssaints.com/news/nf...ls-2931374

I had someone important to me die of ALS.  It is a troubling disease.  The feeling of helplessness is overpowering.

If you're interested in the relation of brain injury to ALS, these two articles (1  and  2) may be of interest.  I haven't studied or researched the relation beyond that.

[fullmetal]

I had someone important to me die of ALS.  It is a troubling disease.  The feeling of helplessness is overpowering.

If you're interested in the relation of brain injury to ALS, these two articles (1  and  2) may be of interest.  I haven't studied or researched the relation beyond that.

I'm sorry to hear :(  Chris Johnson, of CJ2k speed, is unable to lift a cup with his right hand.  He uses a vocoder to talk.  All the span of a year.  Truly a terrible disease.

https://www.tmz.com/2026/06/29/chris-joh...-with-als/
https://sports.yahoo.com/articles/ex-nfl...39025.html

[fullmetal]

I had someone important to me die of ALS.  It is a troubling disease.  The feeling of helplessness is overpowering.

If you're interested in the relation of brain injury to ALS, these two articles (1  and  2) may be of interest.  I haven't studied or researched the relation beyond that.

I'm sorry to hear :(  Chris Johnson, of CJ2k speed, is unable to lift a cup with his right hand.  He uses a vocoder to talk.  All the span of a year.  Truly a terrible disease.

https://www.tmz.com/2026/06/29/chris-joh...-with-als/
https://sports.yahoo.com/articles/ex-nfl...39025.html

[jacket3ree]

Interesting discussion. My uncle had ALS. His decline and death were both rapid, which was a blessing I suppose. He was 88 and some of his last famous words were to his physician upon receiving the diagnosis. "You probably have anywhere between two months and several years." His response was classic: "I could have told you that before coming in this afternoon." He was 88. "Is this advice free?"

My grandfather had a second generation Corvair. Beautiful car. I remember he and my grandmother picked me and my late brother up from atop the Billings, MT Rimrock (home of the airport) when we took our first solo flight from Denver in 1971. My grandfather lost an arm in the war and he rigged everything he owned including the Corvair to deal with that disability. I generally remember the drive back to their house unsafe at whatever speed he was going and my grandmother, the nicest woman to ever grace this earth, yelling at him to remember who was in the back seat.

Times were different. No seatbelts and the only reason we arrived at all, having been dumped at the Western Airlines gate in Denver by Dad, was that my eight year old self recognized the words "Welcome to Casper, Wyoming" (apparently this was not a non-stop, not that I would know what that was) and this was indeed not where Gramafay and Grandy lived, so I hauled my five year old brother back on the plane with zero help from anyone other than a very nice flight attendant who said the plane would keep going to Billings, so getting back on was the smart thing to do. If we were going to Billings. We carried nothing but ourselves. No manifest, no note, no nothing. Our parents were on their way in the car with our baby sister due to arrive not much later that day. This was a special treat. Or maybe our parents hoped they'd be rid of two nasty boys who would get themselves lost in Casper, Wyoming.

[jacket3ree]

Interesting discussion. My uncle had ALS. His decline and death were both rapid, which was a blessing I suppose. He was 88 and some of his last famous words were to his physician upon receiving the diagnosis. "You probably have anywhere between two months and several years." His response was classic: "I could have told you that before coming in this afternoon." He was 88. "Is this advice free?"

My grandfather had a second generation Corvair. Beautiful car. I remember he and my grandmother picked me and my late brother up from atop the Billings, MT Rimrock (home of the airport) when we took our first solo flight from Denver in 1971. My grandfather lost an arm in the war and he rigged everything he owned including the Corvair to deal with that disability. I generally remember the drive back to their house unsafe at whatever speed he was going and my grandmother, the nicest woman to ever grace this earth, yelling at him to remember who was in the back seat.

Times were different. No seatbelts and the only reason we arrived at all, having been dumped at the Western Airlines gate in Denver by Dad, was that my eight year old self recognized the words "Welcome to Casper, Wyoming" (apparently this was not a non-stop, not that I would know what that was) and this was indeed not where Gramafay and Grandy lived, so I hauled my five year old brother back on the plane with zero help from anyone other than a very nice flight attendant who said the plane would keep going to Billings, so getting back on was the smart thing to do. If we were going to Billings. We carried nothing but ourselves. No manifest, no note, no nothing. Our parents were on their way in the car with our baby sister due to arrive not much later that day. This was a special treat. Or maybe our parents hoped they'd be rid of two nasty boys who would get themselves lost in Casper, Wyoming.

[MV72018]

College and professional football are diverting atavisms. 

As is happening with smoking, these "sports" will gradually be terminated when the causal evidence implicating football with CTE becomes widely perceived as undeniable. That time is coming. Do players have to sign "hold harmless agreements" these days before they're allowed to play? If not, that might become required in the near future.

[MV72018]

College and professional football are diverting atavisms. 

As is happening with smoking, these "sports" will gradually be terminated when the causal evidence implicating football with CTE becomes widely perceived as undeniable. That time is coming. Do players have to sign "hold harmless agreements" these days before they're allowed to play? If not, that might become required in the near future.

[martyup]

Nah.  Neither football nor bull riding is going away anytime soon.

[martyup]

Nah.  Neither football nor bull riding is going away anytime soon.

[BostonCard]

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2...udy-finds/

A study by Harvard researchers has found that NFL players are four times more likely to die of degenerative brain diseases than the population overall.  The study was published here:

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclin...4/fulltext

Neurodegenerative mortality was nearly four times higher in NFL players compared to the general population and remained threefold higher after accounting for competing risks. Together, these findings strengthen the evidence for RHI exposure-related neurodegenerative mortality in NFL players that cannot be explained by differential survivorship.

(RHI = repetitive head impact)

BC

[BostonCard]

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2...udy-finds/

A study by Harvard researchers has found that NFL players are four times more likely to die of degenerative brain diseases than the population overall.  The study was published here:

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclin...4/fulltext

Neurodegenerative mortality was nearly four times higher in NFL players compared to the general population and remained threefold higher after accounting for competing risks. Together, these findings strengthen the evidence for RHI exposure-related neurodegenerative mortality in NFL players that cannot be explained by differential survivorship.

(RHI = repetitive head impact)

BC

[Mick]

Nah.  Neither football nor bull riding is going away anytime soon.

Nor rugby. Or wrestling. 

Or club boxing. I wonder if it's worse when it's not a varsity sport, when you have little medical personnel, untrained coaches etc. The NCAA had championships starting in 1932, then discontinued boxing championships after 1960 when a UWisconsin boxer died of a brain hemorrhage. 

But there's a long history of collegiate boxing:

- first boxing training, Harvard, 1859
- first boxing competition, Oxford vs. Cambridge, 1897
- first documented U.S. intercollegiate competition, Penn vs. Colgate, 1920

64 American universities listed boxing clubs last year, including nine in California. Santa Clara, San Jose State, USF. UCLA, UC Berkeley, UC Davis, Sacto State. USC...and Stanford.

In fact, Stanford hosted a "Fight Night" at Burnham Pavilion on January 17 of this year. Two bouts with Stanford boxers fighting each other, others were intercollegiate matchups between boxers from UC Riverside, Oxford University (yes, that one), and Santa Clara. Two of the Stanford victors were a Master's and a PhD candidate. And they did it right...it was sanctioned by USA Boxing, with referees, judges, medical professionals, headgear and gloves.

Stanford boxing hosts first on-campus Fight Night

Here's the full video:  Bing Videos

The Stanford boxers entered the year with a 4-0 record in intercollegiate competition, and last year's club president (and Stanford club athlete of the year) won the USIBA (U. S. Intercollegiate Boxing Association) middleweight championship.

[Mick]

Nah.  Neither football nor bull riding is going away anytime soon.

Nor rugby. Or wrestling. 

Or club boxing. I wonder if it's worse when it's not a varsity sport, when you have little medical personnel, untrained coaches etc. The NCAA had championships starting in 1932, then discontinued boxing championships after 1960 when a UWisconsin boxer died of a brain hemorrhage. 

But there's a long history of collegiate boxing:

- first boxing training, Harvard, 1859
- first boxing competition, Oxford vs. Cambridge, 1897
- first documented U.S. intercollegiate competition, Penn vs. Colgate, 1920

64 American universities listed boxing clubs last year, including nine in California. Santa Clara, San Jose State, USF. UCLA, UC Berkeley, UC Davis, Sacto State. USC...and Stanford.

In fact, Stanford hosted a "Fight Night" at Burnham Pavilion on January 17 of this year. Two bouts with Stanford boxers fighting each other, others were intercollegiate matchups between boxers from UC Riverside, Oxford University (yes, that one), and Santa Clara. Two of the Stanford victors were a Master's and a PhD candidate. And they did it right...it was sanctioned by USA Boxing, with referees, judges, medical professionals, headgear and gloves.

Stanford boxing hosts first on-campus Fight Night

Here's the full video:  Bing Videos

The Stanford boxers entered the year with a 4-0 record in intercollegiate competition, and last year's club president (and Stanford club athlete of the year) won the USIBA (U. S. Intercollegiate Boxing Association) middleweight championship.