[Goose]

Lots of interesting news today. Ukraine has received cluster munitions from Turkey. A couple videos have showed the likely usage of this type of artillery round but was unknown where Ukraine got them.

https://twitter.com/JackDetsch/status/16...-5QHS9LSrg

The whole tweet thread is worth reading. US reticence to provide the DPICM munitions is understandable, but it would seem to be very potentially useful in an offensive especially against entrenched troops.

It is very potentially useful against entrenched troops if they have no or inadequate overhead protection. As probably everybody on this thread already knows, the "finger of God" reputation the HIMARS originally had was earned firing cluster munitions. The high explosive rockets we have now are very effective against point targets. They are not so effective against area targets like troops in the open. They are also not effective if the target is moving or if the location is somewhat uncertain. The rod munitions for HIMARS are not nearly as effective as cluster munitions, despite claims to the contrary. Politics was deeply involved in those tests. That is why the GRAD still uses them.

DPICM fired from 155 mm isn't quite as effective because it delivers a lower volume of munitions. Dual purpose composite munition bomblets are large enough to disable an IFV and in theory a tank. Back "in the day" the the 155 mm recipe was DPICM for armored formations and VT for motor-rifle formations, moving or stopped. IMO the decision to stop using cluster munitions of any kind was stupid. Yes, they don't all explode. But the 95% that do will do a lot of damage that can't be easily done any other way. Sherman was right. War is cruelty and you can't refine it. The corollary fact is that when you try to refine it, you will always fail.

I don't know if we actually have any DPICM is stock that is not expired. That may be why we aren't sending it (besides appearances) because we don't have any?

[Goose]

Lots of interesting news today. Ukraine has received cluster munitions from Turkey. A couple videos have showed the likely usage of this type of artillery round but was unknown where Ukraine got them.

https://twitter.com/JackDetsch/status/16...-5QHS9LSrg

The whole tweet thread is worth reading. US reticence to provide the DPICM munitions is understandable, but it would seem to be very potentially useful in an offensive especially against entrenched troops.

It is very potentially useful against entrenched troops if they have no or inadequate overhead protection. As probably everybody on this thread already knows, the "finger of God" reputation the HIMARS originally had was earned firing cluster munitions. The high explosive rockets we have now are very effective against point targets. They are not so effective against area targets like troops in the open. They are also not effective if the target is moving or if the location is somewhat uncertain. The rod munitions for HIMARS are not nearly as effective as cluster munitions, despite claims to the contrary. Politics was deeply involved in those tests. That is why the GRAD still uses them.

DPICM fired from 155 mm isn't quite as effective because it delivers a lower volume of munitions. Dual purpose composite munition bomblets are large enough to disable an IFV and in theory a tank. Back "in the day" the the 155 mm recipe was DPICM for armored formations and VT for motor-rifle formations, moving or stopped. IMO the decision to stop using cluster munitions of any kind was stupid. Yes, they don't all explode. But the 95% that do will do a lot of damage that can't be easily done any other way. Sherman was right. War is cruelty and you can't refine it. The corollary fact is that when you try to refine it, you will always fail.

I don't know if we actually have any DPICM is stock that is not expired. That may be why we aren't sending it (besides appearances) because we don't have any?