[JJJ]

[quote author=stanfan95118 link=topic=12466.msg123619#msg123619 date=1438878113]
I don't understand what they're doing with Kaumatule. He's a 280 pound outside linebacker?

I have to agree, and I'm beginning to feel like the coaches (who I am usually pretty hesitant to criticize), really botched his development.  Wasted time at TE, now a OLB with DE size.  I imagine that he will come in on those times when its more of a clear passing down for the offense, as a de facto DE.  And if that is the case, maybe he has a productive spot on the team.  But it just seems his career could have been handled better.
[/quote]

I, too, have to agree. Wasted TE experiment.

[JJJ]

[quote author=stanfan95118 link=topic=12466.msg123619#msg123619 date=1438878113]
I don't understand what they're doing with Kaumatule. He's a 280 pound outside linebacker?

I have to agree, and I'm beginning to feel like the coaches (who I am usually pretty hesitant to criticize), really botched his development.  Wasted time at TE, now a OLB with DE size.  I imagine that he will come in on those times when its more of a clear passing down for the offense, as a de facto DE.  And if that is the case, maybe he has a productive spot on the team.  But it just seems his career could have been handled better.
[/quote]

I, too, have to agree. Wasted TE experiment.

[winflop]

[quote author=stanfan95118 link=topic=12466.msg123619#msg123619 date=1438878113]
I don't understand what they're doing with Kaumatule. He's a 280 pound outside linebacker?

I have to agree, and I'm beginning to feel like the coaches (who I am usually pretty hesitant to criticize), really botched his development.  Wasted time at TE, now a OLB with DE size.  I imagine that he will come in on those times when its more of a clear passing down for the offense, as a de facto DE.  And if that is the case, maybe he has a productive spot on the team.  But it just seems his career could have been handled better.
[/quote]

I'm not so sure.  I wonder if he was just a phenomenal all-around athlete who may not have been skilled enough to earn a starting job at any of these positions.

[winflop]

[quote author=stanfan95118 link=topic=12466.msg123619#msg123619 date=1438878113]
I don't understand what they're doing with Kaumatule. He's a 280 pound outside linebacker?

I have to agree, and I'm beginning to feel like the coaches (who I am usually pretty hesitant to criticize), really botched his development.  Wasted time at TE, now a OLB with DE size.  I imagine that he will come in on those times when its more of a clear passing down for the offense, as a de facto DE.  And if that is the case, maybe he has a productive spot on the team.  But it just seems his career could have been handled better.
[/quote]

I'm not so sure.  I wonder if he was just a phenomenal all-around athlete who may not have been skilled enough to earn a starting job at any of these positions.

[PrinceLightfoot]

Wouldn't Burkett be the 2nd string center?

My bad. Off the top of my head I thought the starter was Schuler followed by Caspers who I thought received time in the spring at center. Apologies for the misinformation.

[PrinceLightfoot]

Wouldn't Burkett be the 2nd string center?

My bad. Off the top of my head I thought the starter was Schuler followed by Caspers who I thought received time in the spring at center. Apologies for the misinformation.

[terry]

Off the top of my head I thought the starter was Schuler followed by Caspers who I thought received time in the spring at center.

Caspers did get a lot of time at center in the spring. My guess is that Caspers probably will be the #2 center.

[terry]

Off the top of my head I thought the starter was Schuler followed by Caspers who I thought received time in the spring at center.

Caspers did get a lot of time at center in the spring. My guess is that Caspers probably will be the #2 center.

[OutsiderFan]

OK, after studying the weights of the OL and DL, I have some observations and questions.

In general, Stanford players seem to be getting lighter, as if there is some sort of commitment to have nobody over 300 pounds.    Josh Garnett is the lone exception on the entire roster.  And no DL is over 285 (Annan). 

Can anyone speak to any concerted effort to make sure the linemen aren't carrying extra weight just to be bigger?  I mean I know Turley's MO is having guys who are flexible and can move the opponent against his will, but this team seems awfully light by major college football standards, in the trenches.

[OutsiderFan]

OK, after studying the weights of the OL and DL, I have some observations and questions.

In general, Stanford players seem to be getting lighter, as if there is some sort of commitment to have nobody over 300 pounds.    Josh Garnett is the lone exception on the entire roster.  And no DL is over 285 (Annan). 

Can anyone speak to any concerted effort to make sure the linemen aren't carrying extra weight just to be bigger?  I mean I know Turley's MO is having guys who are flexible and can move the opponent against his will, but this team seems awfully light by major college football standards, in the trenches.

[Hurlburt88]

I suspect we would like more heft on the DL, but don't have the right people this year. 

the OL puzzles me . . . let's see how they do on 3rd & 1 with a push! 

[Hurlburt88]

I suspect we would like more heft on the DL, but don't have the right people this year. 

the OL puzzles me . . . let's see how they do on 3rd & 1 with a push! 

[Hulk01]

Luke seems to have no feel for football.  If you lack that feel, there's no position for you.

[Hulk01]

Luke seems to have no feel for football.  If you lack that feel, there's no position for you.

[BostonCard]

OK, after studying the weights of the OL and DL, I have some observations and questions.

In general, Stanford players seem to be getting lighter, as if there is some sort of commitment to have nobody over 300 pounds.    Josh Garnett is the lone exception on the entire roster.  And no DL is over 285 (Annan). 

Can anyone speak to any concerted effort to make sure the linemen aren't carrying extra weight just to be bigger?  I mean I know Turley's MO is having guys who are flexible and can move the opponent against his will, but this team seems awfully light by major college football standards, in the trenches.

I hesitate to put too much trust in the roster weights, which aren't always accurate.

BC

[BostonCard]

OK, after studying the weights of the OL and DL, I have some observations and questions.

In general, Stanford players seem to be getting lighter, as if there is some sort of commitment to have nobody over 300 pounds.    Josh Garnett is the lone exception on the entire roster.  And no DL is over 285 (Annan). 

Can anyone speak to any concerted effort to make sure the linemen aren't carrying extra weight just to be bigger?  I mean I know Turley's MO is having guys who are flexible and can move the opponent against his will, but this team seems awfully light by major college football standards, in the trenches.

I hesitate to put too much trust in the roster weights, which aren't always accurate.

BC

[Rally]

[quote author=OutsiderFan link=topic=12466.msg123858#msg123858 date=1439121208]
OK, after studying the weights of the OL and DL, I have some observations and questions.

In general, Stanford players seem to be getting lighter, as if there is some sort of commitment to have nobody over 300 pounds.    Josh Garnett is the lone exception on the entire roster.  And no DL is over 285 (Annan). 

Can anyone speak to any concerted effort to make sure the linemen aren't carrying extra weight just to be bigger?  I mean I know Turley's MO is having guys who are flexible and can move the opponent against his will, but this team seems awfully light by major college football standards, in the trenches.

I hesitate to put too much trust in the roster weights, which aren't always accurate.

BC
[/quote]

Oftentimes the truth doesn't come out until the NFL Combine :)

[Rally]

[quote author=OutsiderFan link=topic=12466.msg123858#msg123858 date=1439121208]
OK, after studying the weights of the OL and DL, I have some observations and questions.

In general, Stanford players seem to be getting lighter, as if there is some sort of commitment to have nobody over 300 pounds.    Josh Garnett is the lone exception on the entire roster.  And no DL is over 285 (Annan). 

Can anyone speak to any concerted effort to make sure the linemen aren't carrying extra weight just to be bigger?  I mean I know Turley's MO is having guys who are flexible and can move the opponent against his will, but this team seems awfully light by major college football standards, in the trenches.

I hesitate to put too much trust in the roster weights, which aren't always accurate.

BC
[/quote]

Oftentimes the truth doesn't come out until the NFL Combine :)

[OutsiderFan]

Rather than whistle past the graveyard, let's assume the weights are in fact real.

Can Stanford field a credible defense with it's largest DL being 280?  Can it be considered a power running team with only 5 OL over 300 pounds?

[OutsiderFan]

Rather than whistle past the graveyard, let's assume the weights are in fact real.

Can Stanford field a credible defense with it's largest DL being 280?  Can it be considered a power running team with only 5 OL over 300 pounds?

[JohnR34231]

With CMac as our featured running back, I didn't think we were going to try to be a power running team, although Shaw said he is capable of running inside.

[JohnR34231]

With CMac as our featured running back, I didn't think we were going to try to be a power running team, although Shaw said he is capable of running inside.

[Spiny_Norman]

Per Andy Drukarev, Jordan Fox is the frosh who will not be with the team this year.

https://stanford.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1790575

"Jordan Fox right now has some academic things he's got to finish for us before he joins the football team," Shaw said. "He's still one of ours, he's still one of our guys. We look forward to him joining the football team next fall."

[Spiny_Norman]

Per Andy Drukarev, Jordan Fox is the frosh who will not be with the team this year.

https://stanford.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1790575

"Jordan Fox right now has some academic things he's got to finish for us before he joins the football team," Shaw said. "He's still one of ours, he's still one of our guys. We look forward to him joining the football team next fall."

[BostonCard]

Rather than whistle past the graveyard, let's assume the weights are in fact real.

Can Stanford field a credible defense with it's largest DL being 280?  Can it be considered a power running team with only 5 OL over 300 pounds?

Why? They have not been accurate in the past.  What makes you think they are accurate now?

BC

[BostonCard]

Rather than whistle past the graveyard, let's assume the weights are in fact real.

Can Stanford field a credible defense with it's largest DL being 280?  Can it be considered a power running team with only 5 OL over 300 pounds?

Why? They have not been accurate in the past.  What makes you think they are accurate now?

BC

[yvonne]

Flawed premises lead to incorrect conclusions.

[yvonne]

Flawed premises lead to incorrect conclusions.

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be.  Shaw has given a lot of lip service to McCaffrey's versatility (particularly his ability to catch the ball) so between he and Sanders (I'm still holding out hope for him) I'm predicting the offense to spread the field a lot more.  Not a spread offense per se, just more "spread" than perhaps we're used to.

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be.  Shaw has given a lot of lip service to McCaffrey's versatility (particularly his ability to catch the ball) so between he and Sanders (I'm still holding out hope for him) I'm predicting the offense to spread the field a lot more.  Not a spread offense per se, just more "spread" than perhaps we're used to.

[Rally]

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be.  Shaw has given a lot of lip service to McCaffrey's versatility (particularly his ability to catch the ball) so between he and Sanders (I'm still holding out hope for him) I'm predicting the offense to spread the field a lot more.  Not a spread offense per se, just more "spread" than perhaps we're used to.

We'll see but a bell cow doesn't need to run between the tackles.  Maybe a few times to keep the D honest, but not always.  Stefan, it seems, was always sneaking out to the flat, looking for that outlet.  Gaffney and Gerhardt not as much.  I'm thinking an OJ. 

[Rally]

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be.  Shaw has given a lot of lip service to McCaffrey's versatility (particularly his ability to catch the ball) so between he and Sanders (I'm still holding out hope for him) I'm predicting the offense to spread the field a lot more.  Not a spread offense per se, just more "spread" than perhaps we're used to.

We'll see but a bell cow doesn't need to run between the tackles.  Maybe a few times to keep the D honest, but not always.  Stefan, it seems, was always sneaking out to the flat, looking for that outlet.  Gaffney and Gerhardt not as much.  I'm thinking an OJ. 

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

[quote author=ThePassionOfTheChryst link=topic=12466.msg124016#msg124016 date=1439262404]
Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be.  Shaw has given a lot of lip service to McCaffrey's versatility (particularly his ability to catch the ball) so between he and Sanders (I'm still holding out hope for him) I'm predicting the offense to spread the field a lot more.  Not a spread offense per se, just more "spread" than perhaps we're used to.

We'll see but a bell cow doesn't need to run between the tackles.  Maybe a few times to keep the D honest, but not always.  Stefan, it seems, was always sneaking out to the flat, looking for that outlet.  Gaffney and Gerhardt not as much.  I'm thinking an OJ.
[/quote]

That was my point.  I don't see McCaffrey pounding it between the tackles 40 times a game.

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

[quote author=ThePassionOfTheChryst link=topic=12466.msg124016#msg124016 date=1439262404]
Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be.  Shaw has given a lot of lip service to McCaffrey's versatility (particularly his ability to catch the ball) so between he and Sanders (I'm still holding out hope for him) I'm predicting the offense to spread the field a lot more.  Not a spread offense per se, just more "spread" than perhaps we're used to.

We'll see but a bell cow doesn't need to run between the tackles.  Maybe a few times to keep the D honest, but not always.  Stefan, it seems, was always sneaking out to the flat, looking for that outlet.  Gaffney and Gerhardt not as much.  I'm thinking an OJ.
[/quote]

That was my point.  I don't see McCaffrey pounding it between the tackles 40 times a game.

[CTcard]

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, I am not sure that a line with projected starters at 301 lbs, 321 lbs, 285 lbs, 300 lbs, 300 lbs  - with extra linemen ready to come in at 300 lbs and 300 lbs is exactly characterized as light.

... though I suppose I might be a little suspicious of four guys listed at exactly 300 lbs.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be. 

Whether a team can effectively operate a power run game depends as much on the strengths of the OL as the RB. In fact, running Power is explicitly about blocking assignments.
Nobody speculating about what kind of running game we should run seems to say anything about the strengths of the OL.

[CTcard]

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, I am not sure that a line with projected starters at 301 lbs, 321 lbs, 285 lbs, 300 lbs, 300 lbs  - with extra linemen ready to come in at 300 lbs and 300 lbs is exactly characterized as light.

... though I suppose I might be a little suspicious of four guys listed at exactly 300 lbs.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be. 

Whether a team can effectively operate a power run game depends as much on the strengths of the OL as the RB. In fact, running Power is explicitly about blocking assignments.
Nobody speculating about what kind of running game we should run seems to say anything about the strengths of the OL.

[Rally]

[quote author=ThePassionOfTheChryst link=topic=12466.msg124016#msg124016 date=1439262404]
Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, I am not sure that a line with projected starters at 301 lbs, 321 lbs, 285 lbs, 300 lbs, 300 lbs  - with extra linemen ready to come in at 300 lbs and 300 lbs is exactly characterized as light.

... though I suppose I might be a little suspicious of four guys listed at exactly 300 lbs.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be. 

Whether a team can effectively operate a power run game depends as much on the strengths of the OL as the RB. In fact, running Power is explicitly about blocking assignments.
Nobody speculating about what kind of running game we should run seems to say anything about the strengths of the OL.
[/quote]

It seems to me Turley emphasizes power and flexibility, not weight.  That's why our guys typicall don't perform that well on the Combine strength tests.  I think I read once he said bench pressing has little to do with moving your man somewhere he doesn't want to go.  Maybe wishful thinking on my part.  Big ole fat plugs aren't going to move the pile if all they can do is eat.  Mind you, a fast, agile, strong 330 pounder will usually beat the equivalent 290 pounder but there aren't too many of those around, are there?  Hope springs eternal.

[Rally]

[quote author=ThePassionOfTheChryst link=topic=12466.msg124016#msg124016 date=1439262404]
Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, light offensive linemen do not preclude power running.  Quick and strong can do the job just fine.

Even if we assume the weights listed on the roster are correct, I am not sure that a line with projected starters at 301 lbs, 321 lbs, 285 lbs, 300 lbs, 300 lbs  - with extra linemen ready to come in at 300 lbs and 300 lbs is exactly characterized as light.

... though I suppose I might be a little suspicious of four guys listed at exactly 300 lbs.

As someone said earlier though, if McCaffrey will indeed be the bellcow I'm not sure how power-oriented the ground game will be. 

Whether a team can effectively operate a power run game depends as much on the strengths of the OL as the RB. In fact, running Power is explicitly about blocking assignments.
Nobody speculating about what kind of running game we should run seems to say anything about the strengths of the OL.
[/quote]

It seems to me Turley emphasizes power and flexibility, not weight.  That's why our guys typicall don't perform that well on the Combine strength tests.  I think I read once he said bench pressing has little to do with moving your man somewhere he doesn't want to go.  Maybe wishful thinking on my part.  Big ole fat plugs aren't going to move the pile if all they can do is eat.  Mind you, a fast, agile, strong 330 pounder will usually beat the equivalent 290 pounder but there aren't too many of those around, are there?  Hope springs eternal.

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

Whether a team can effectively operate a power run game depends as much on the strengths of the OL as the RB. In fact, running Power is explicitly about blocking assignments.
Nobody speculating about what kind of running game we should run seems to say anything about the strengths of the OL.

For a power run game to be successful, your back needs to be able to take a beating.  There's no two ways about it.  Even the best OL can only do so much.  I'm not doubting that Christian is a tough kid who can grind out the tough yards, but he's not exactly built to do it play after play for 13-14 (hopefully 15  ;D) games.  He's much more Reggie Bush than he is LenDale White.

[ThePassionOfTheChryst]

Whether a team can effectively operate a power run game depends as much on the strengths of the OL as the RB. In fact, running Power is explicitly about blocking assignments.
Nobody speculating about what kind of running game we should run seems to say anything about the strengths of the OL.

For a power run game to be successful, your back needs to be able to take a beating.  There's no two ways about it.  Even the best OL can only do so much.  I'm not doubting that Christian is a tough kid who can grind out the tough yards, but he's not exactly built to do it play after play for 13-14 (hopefully 15  ;D) games.  He's much more Reggie Bush than he is LenDale White.